We're posting new material at GoingToTehran.com. Please join us there.

The Race for Iran


As part of the current and ongoing effort to demonize further the Islamic Republic, there has been an uptick in media stories, drawing on conveniently leaked Western intelligence assessments, highlighting Tehran’s allegedly looming acquisition of nuclear weapons.  One of these stories, from The Associated Press, see here, seems particularly emblematic, so we want to look at it more closely. 

The story opens by citing an “intelligence assessment shared with The Associated Press” from “a nation with traditionally reliable intelligence from the region”, which depicts Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as wanting “to shed the nation’s secrecy and forge ahead openly with developing nuclear weapons” but also as “opposed by the clerical leadership, which is worried about international reaction to such a move.”  The story notes that this particular assessment “cannot be confirmed and contrasts with assessments by other countries that view Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as relatively moderate on the nuclear issue compared to the country’s Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei”. 

Now, obviously, the first and second assessments cannot both be true, which should prompt some very hard questions about how good any of these services’ sources are.  (Does any nation, in fact, have “traditionally reliable intelligence from the region”, particularly with regard to high-level decision-making?  We would not apply that description to the United States, Israel, the United Kingdom, France, or Germany.  Who else is out there?)  But that does not seem to matter. 

The main point, according to The Associated Press, is that “as Iran’s capacity to build nuclear weapons grows, intelligence assessments from nations that follow Tehran’s atomic progress discern increasing indecision and squabbling by its leadership on whether to make such arms—and, if so, how overtly.”  OK, but even if this is true, does it not mean that senior officials in Tehran, including Ayatollah Khamenei, have not actually taken a decision to proceed with weaponization? 

But whether authoritative decision-makers in Tehran have in fact opted to build nuclear weapons does not seem to factor into current discussions in Washington and other Western capitals, either.  Ray Takeyh recently published an Op Ed, see here, in the Washington Post arguing that the Islamic Republic is moving inexorably toward fabricating weapons and it is just a matter of time before it gets there.  At that point, Takeyh opines, neither the Middle East’s balance of power nor Washington’s partisan political struggle will be able to tolerate the new reality.  He foresees fallout in Washington comparable to the “Who Lost China?” debate of the early 1950s.  (As we have sometimes been compared to the “China hands” of that period, we must admit that we were momentarily taken aback by that prediction.)  But all of this skips over the prior question—what is the evidence that the Islamic Republic wants to build nuclear weapons? 

Against this, we want to juxtapose a portion of an interview that Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad gave to Euronews this week, where he discusses the nuclear issue.   To see the interview or read a full transcript, click here; in the interview, Ahmadinejad also offers interesting observations about the Arab spring, the Islamic Republic’s 2009 presidential election, and Iran’s relations with the West.  Ahmadinejad’s points on the nuclear issue are not new; he is not making them in response to some specific new set of international pressures.  Ahmadinejad, the current Foreign Minister, Dr. Salehi, and his predecessor, and other senior Iranian officials have been saying these things literally for years. But, in the current climate, they warrant careful attention.

Euronews:  With respect, Mr President, with regard to the nuclear issue, which worries not only the United States, when you say one thing and appear to do something different it doesn’t engender the conditions for anybody to become more friendly and extend that hand of peace.

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad:  Why? What have we done wrong?

Euronews:  Well specifically in terms of the nuclear program, you say—and I have no reason to disbelieve you….

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad:  Is nuclear activity forbidden?

Euronews:  I’m not even saying they’re prohibited.  Let me explain.  Your stated aim is that your nuclear program is for peaceful means, to produce electricity and energy, and I challenge anybody to argue with that as a peaceful goal.  However, there is the belief among scientists in the West, outside Iran, that you are in fact enriching uranium to such a level—20 percent specifically—that there’s no connection at all with peaceful production of energy for the use of a peaceful people.  So what we have is that, on one hand, you are saying something in public, that you want to use it for peaceful means.  On the other hand, you appear to be doing something that only has one objective, and that is to work towards a bomb.

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad:  You ask a very good question.  I just felt you were very sincere in your question.  Allow me to explain.  Firstly, those who claim that we are moving towards military activities are not Western scientists, they are Western politicians.  So if you put this into the context of the western hostility towards Iran…

Euronews:  Is Iran enriching uranium to 20 percent?

President Ahmadinejad:  Yes.

Euronews:  And do you have plans to triple that production of uranium at 20 percent?

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad:  The production of uranium at 20 per cent is just for peaceful purposes.  This is for a reactor that produces active radio drops.  It just produces drops.  The 20 percent is not good for anything else, it’s only good for drugs and agricultural purposes.  The countries that are capable of enriching uranium can produce uranium at any percentage.  This is the capability that we have.  At the same time, we’re among the limited number of countries whose activities are under the control of the IAEA cameras.  When we say we don’t have any intention to build a bomb, we’re honest and sincere.  We believe that today if someone wants to build a bomb he’s crazy and insane.  This is for two reasons. 

One is that those who have bombs are in graver danger than those who don’t.  The bombs that exist in Germany, in Belgium and other European countries cause a great threat to all European countries.  An atomic bomb is against all humans. 

Second, the nuclear bomb is useless and ineffective.  The Zionist regime has nuclear bombs.  At the same time, did it succeed in its war against the Gazans?  Did its nuclear bomb give it victory in the 33 Day War against Lebanon?  Allow me to ask another question—were the former Soviet Union’s nuclear bombs able to save the Soviet Union from collapse?  Nuclear bombs were used 60 years ago in order to provide an upper hand in political equations, but today they have no value.  Thought has value, public opinion has value, human beings have value.  We believe that in the future no one will ever be able to use nuclear bombs.  We believe that’s the end of the story.”

This is getting ever more reminiscent of the fraudulent case for war that was laid in the run-up to America’s 2003 invasion of Iraq.  And, as in that episode, the mainstream media are, to a great extent, failing to do minimal due diligence on the intelligence assessments and other official views that are so conveniently made available for them.

–Flynt Leverett and Hillary Mann Leverett



  1. Kathleen says:

    “even Greta Van Sustaren ask how 84 congress people can take trips to Israel during the recess. ( I thought there was legislation passed so lobbyist were not able to pay for Congress people’s trips)

    How could Congress be so tone-deaf as to go to Israel when US is in crisis?? Greta Van Susteren asks


    I just received a press release [included at link] that 84 Members of Congress are taking a free trip next week to Israel.

    Please tell me this is not so: that while we are in crisis, 84 Members of Congress are getting an all expense paid trip to Israel instead of returning to DC to work on our economic crisis (or even review the March GAO report which outlines billions of dollars of waste that they are ignoring but you are paying????) How could they?””

    Wasserman Schult as radical and rabid on the Israeli Palestinian conflict as the very dangerous Ros Lehtinen has and continues to be. Neither one of them really cares about US National Security. But when it comes to Israel no matter what they do…They are on the bus even when it comes to undermining US National Security

  2. Voice of Tehran says:

    @ All
    Nader Telebzadeh in his TV Show ” RAZ ” on IRIB 4 , brought forward an interseting theory , which he claimed is still not methodologically sound and needes further research. ( he and his team are currently working on this subject) )
    In 1979 the American population stood at 210 millon , today it is surpassing 315 million , thus an increase of more than 100 million in 30 years , through immigration , green card lotteries etc.
    Further he claimed , that 30 % of the US army consists of immigrants and usually this is the group , which serves as cannon fodder in the wars since 1991.
    May it is worth thinking about this topic and its consequences.

  3. Scott Lucas says:


    And thanks for the heads-up on Blackberry Messenger but I don’t intend to let any government get between me and my BBM….


  4. Scott Lucas says:


    “Community leaders say inequality, cuts to public services by the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition government and youth unemployment fed into the violence in London, Birmingham, Manchester and other multi-ethnic cities.””

    I am in full agreement with this assessment….


  5. fyi says:


    United States Department of State. Glennon, John P., Editor
    Foreign relations of the United States, 1952-1954. Iran, 1952-1954
    Volume X
    U.S. Government Printing Office, 1952-1954


  6. James Canning says:


    Yes, it is plausible that the Iranian government would prefer that Hillary Clinton ‘de-list’ the MEK.

  7. James Canning says:


    If you are saying there is a deep social pathology in the UK (and the US for that matter), causing millions of young people to lack discipline, self-control, self-respect, etc., of course I very much agree with you. And to say this condition will not go away soon cannot be challenged. And one can argue the problem will only get worse.

    I don’t think the idea is to replace the ‘white’ working class with Chinese, or Indian Sikhs and Hindus, etc. Most of the Asian immigrants who get ahead in the UK and the US, do so through their own small businesses. They and their families are proprietors as well as staff. Lebanese do this all over West Africa. And Jamaica, for that matter. Indians used to do it in Kenya, Uganda, etc.

  8. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 11, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    The de-listing of MEK is an excellent opportunity of Iran to make propaganda points about US having “her terrorists” ( as well EU in general).

    MEK is not a threat to Iran and is useless as a military or political force opposing the Islamic Republic.

    The Iraian leaders no doubt frevently hope for its de-listing.

  9. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 11, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    India and Korea have good relations with US, UK and other member states of the Axis Powewrs.

    Nevertheless, they have experienced massive brain drain over the last 40 years.

    Brain drain does not, by itself, indicate much beyond economic opportunity.

  10. James Canning says:

    The Financial Times reported today that several dozen American experts on the Middle East came out publicly opposed to the ‘de-listing’ of the MEK, by the US State Dept.

  11. kooshy says:

    James asks

    “Why do you think so many Chinese immigrants to the UK, do so well even if they arrive quite poor?”

    Well, my dear Sahib James, according to your line of thinking and the regime in UK this is because they are Chinese, however I think it’s a bit late for the UK to change the non-chines working class with the more productive chines ones without having street battles, that’s why yesterday I said it will not get fixed.

  12. James Canning says:


    Interesting post (re: tax benefits for those who pay for trips by US Congressmen to Israel). Clearly, if Aipac wants something from the US Congress, Aipac gets it.

  13. James Canning says:


    I am fascinated that Bowles seems to argue that ‘subjugation of the working class’ is the basis for the retention of Northern Ireland in the UK. Most of the people of Northern Ireland want to remain part of the UK. Do you think this wish should be thwarted?

    I have a cousin who works with the ‘underclass’ in London, and she is well versed in the various distinctions that can be drawn between some elements of that ‘underclass’, and other elements. A lack of discipine and self-respect is a problem frequently encountered. What creates this situation can be argued.

    Why do you think so many Chinese immigrants to the UK, do so well even if they arrive quite poor?

  14. kooshy says:


    Here is what I mean by getting violated.

    “”As to the lawless minority, the criminals who’ve taken what they can get, I say this: We will track you down, we will find you, we will charge you, we will punish you. You will pay for what you have done,” Cameron said.

    Police have arrested more than 1,200 people across England, filling cells and forcing courts to work through the night to process hundreds of cases. Among those charged were a teaching assistant, a charity worker and an 11-year-old boy.

    Community leaders say inequality, cuts to public services by the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition government and youth unemployment fed into the violence in London, Birmingham, Manchester and other multi-ethnic cities.”


    Mr. Cameron and his supporters should be ashamed of themselves

  15. James Canning says:


    Yes, Joel Hayward (dean of RAF College) was quite right to declare on May 8th: ‘Preventing civilian deaths in Benghazi is one thing; militarily supporting the armed resistance of people NATO knows almost nothing about is quite different.’

    The Harmsworth family is not Jewish.

  16. kooshy says:


    Great to hear that you are safe and sound, however according to reliable sources on the ground in the UK, one really should be very careful using Blackberry’s messaging future these days in there, to reduce chance of getting violated (human rights) by this regime in London, and her associated youth speedy drivers.


  17. James Canning says:

    Voice of Tehran,

    Is ‘the west’ bankrupt? Economically? What is the average salary at Microsoft these days? I think it is about $175,000. Average annual pay, for staff at this corporation. Many job applicants to this company would dispute your claim the ‘west’ is ‘bankrupt’. I think there are many thousands of Asians trying to get permits to work in the US, so they can enjoy a job at Microsoft (or other tech companies).

  18. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    I agree with your comment to Paul, that if Iran and the US had restored normal relations long ago, there would be no sanctions, no ‘brain-drain’ from Iran, and Iran would be much more prosperous. The ISRAEL LOBBY blocked restoration of normal relations between Iran and the US, back in the 1990s and in the early 2000s.

    We should remember that the UK suffered a ‘brain-drain’ for decades, back in the 1960s and 1970s, due to bad tax policy, poor economic planning, etc.

  19. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    Surely Ghulam Asghar Khan is quite wrong to argue the US is attempting to create an independent Balochistan, carved from Pakistan. China and the US, and other countries, in fact are concerned that Pakistan may become unglued.

    It is true that some delusional neocons, and other zealous ‘supporters’ of Israel right or wrong, would welocme a breakup of Syria, Iraq, Iran, and other countries, to provide cover for their dreams of a ‘Greater Israel’. But this is pure delusion.

  20. James Canning says:


    I agree with you that the notion of America as a ‘Perfect Society’ is preposterous. And that the millions of people who relocate in the US do so in expectation of material gain. There are other reasons, of course.

    Why do you think recent immigrants, arriving with very little in America, within a few decades are much better off economically and educationally, than scores of millions of Americans whose families have been in the US for multiple generations?

  21. hans says:

    @Sineva says:
    August 11, 2011 at 9:06 am

    Thanks for the info.

  22. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Washington’s sinister Balochistan strategy


    Money quote:

    The UN Charter explicitly forbids member nations, which includes both the US and Israel, from not only the use of force, but threatening the use of force in international relations. There are only circumstances under which a resort to the use of force is considered legitimate under international law. The first is the use of armed force in self-defence against an armed attack. The second is if there is explicit authorisation for the use of force under an unequivocal mandate from the UN Security Council (UNSC). So, every time the US or the Israeli government threatens Iran with a military attack against its nuclear programme, it would be the violation of the UN Charter.Opening a US Consulate office in Quetta would amount to providing safe haven to the CIA and its mercenary groups to extend their sabotage activities to Iran from the Pakistani soil. It is a serious threat not be taken lightly by Islamabad. It might just be posturing by the US with Israel being at the back of this serious deception. Both nations have repeatedly shown a willingness to reject diplomacy and use military force to pursue their respective policies. Keeping aside the question of illegality and morality, there are plenty of reasons for the US and Israel not to launch Iraq and Afghanistan like invasions on Iran, but to use Balochistan as a bastion to bring instability in Iran through their secret commandos. And there is no shortage of such mercenaries in the CIA. Right now, US secret commandos are carrying out raids in 70 countries. By the end of the year, the number would probably be close to 120. gasghar20@gmail.com

  23. fyi says:

    Persian Gulf says: August 11, 2011 at 8:39 am

    The fake Ph.D.s (very many on the Expediency Council) and assorted other opportunists do wish for more brain drain from Iran because they or their associates will not have to compete against smart and capable people.

    There is also the class envy that wishes to rid Iran of the upper classes so that, just like the early years of the Iranian revolution, they could wallow in dirt and squalor.

    You are too young perhaps to remembebr this perhaps, but in 1980s, while travelling with train, you could see that the train had not been cleaned for years. The carpet had been so batted down with grime and dirt that it had become like linoleum.

    I think the basic idea was that they could use the oil money to not work and live their low class lives in dirt without anyone telling them what to do or how to improve their lives.

    The same thing happened in China during the Cultural Revolution but there people were murdered by the hundreds of thousands.

    Never underestimate the effect of (class) envy in human affairs.

  24. Unknown Unknowns says:

    BiBiJon @ August 11, 2011 at 8:59 am

    To paraphrase Michelle O’Bumma: This is NOT the first time that I am really proud of my country :p

  25. Sineva says:

    The author of that very true quote is Georges Clemenceau,I have it along with a few other quotes that I like stuck to my mantlepiece

  26. BiBiJon says:

    And, they claim the Iranian government is anti-American!

    “Iran names street after Rachel Corrie

    Tehran pays tribute to US activist crushed to death by bulldozer while trying stop the demolition of Palestinian homes”


  27. Unknown Unknowns says:


    I resemble that remark too :D except that you are much better at navigating the demanding and indeed unforgiving whitewaters of the empirical than I am or ever will be. Your website is a brilliant testament to this.

    I am all for empirical data – I won’t call them ‘facts’ as to me, facts are what you believe in, But that’s a whole ‘nother story. What I was poking fun at was not the empirical, but empiricism and its philosophical corollary, logico-positivism, and their *reductio ad absurdem* of the world and everything in it.

    Here, I’ll tell you a little story.

    One night a passer by came across Mulla Nasreddin searching for something on his hands and knees under a streetlight. He quickly joined him, hoping to find what it was that the good mulla had lost. After a while, Nasreddin gave up, “Ah, its no use!”

    “But why, Mullah? What is it that you have lost?”

    “My house key,” he said.

    “But surely, if this is where you lost it, it is bound to be around. When was the last time you saw it?”

    “It was about 20 yards that way,” the Mulla said, pointing to the direction of his house. “I was getting it out of my cloak to open the front door, and it fell out of my hand!”

    “But surely,” said the bewildered passer-by, “if that is where you lost it, then that is where it will be. Why on earth are you looking for it *here*?”

    “Well, I *did* look for it there, but after a little while I gave up and came here, ’cause it’s dark over there and I couldn’t see anything and its brighter here.”

  28. Persian Gulf says:

    Voice of Tehran says:
    August 11, 2011 at 5:04 am

    “There is a rapid rerversal of this trend , once the last moron grasps the fact that the West is bankrupt.”

    do you have any numbers for this claim? specially from the west? to me it seems a bit strange. few of my friends got back (some for family related issues & some couldn’t stay for legal reasons), but the majority stayed abroad (these are the ones that left the country for education. the ones who migrated are less likely to be back). last time in Iran, I was asked by a group of profs in a meeting what percentage get back and what percentage stay there and for what reasons? I didn’t want to disappoint them. so I said, I guess 25% get back (which even myself didn’t believe). I also said, 50% won’t be back under current social circumstances, not bc they are political activists.

  29. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Yes, paul, well put; an interesting angle to look at the issue of the Iranian brain drain. What I had meant to add, but forgot, to my last post is that if the US had recognized the Islamic Republic of Iran years ago, there would be no sanctions, there would be hundreds of millions of dollars of investment (if not tens of billions), the political climate would have been much different, and brain-drain would be a non-issue. So, in a sense, in a sense, the bleeding of many of Iran’s best and brightest is a symptom of Iran having been struck by the sword of the US imperium.

    My best guess for that quote is Vidal, though it has been a while since I came across it.

  30. BiBiJon says:


    “This is an empirical fact (for those of you in the audience who are turned on by such things).”

    I resemble that remark!

    Seriously, part of the reason I listen to you rather than Binams and Namdars of this forum are empirical data such as:

    “a clear majority of Iranians express satisfaction with the “process by which the authorities are elected in this country” (62%, including 18% very satisfied and 44% somewhat satisfied) and approved of “the way President Ahmadinejad is handling his job as president” (66%). These approval ratings lie roughly midway between Iranian support for the “ideal” of a free and direct popular vote for political leaders (86% support – see paragraph above) and support for a religious autocracy (38%). While many observers characterize the present Iranian political system as a religious autocracy, evidently many Iranians do not see it that way.”

    From 2008 http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/brmiddleeastnafricara/527.php

    And that a 2010 IPI/Charney Research poll on Iran which shows 54% “say things in Iran are headed in the right direction”, and 82% rate the work of the national government as excellent, good, or fair.

    From ,http://www.ipinst.org/images/pdfs/cr_iran_2010_survey_frequency_questionnaire.pdf

    I don’t recall the Leveretts opining on Iran’s internal affairs as such. If they have pointed out the green movement does not muster anywhere near majority support, they have said so in the context of US policies which favors delaying engagement until there’s been a regime change. Well, that is like saying no engagement until the cows come home. Preconditioning detente and rapprochement to some unlikely future event is to fool the gullible about one’s real agenda.

  31. Rehmat says:

    Alaeddin Borujerdi, head of Iran’s Majlis’ foreign affair committee is visiting Egypt for the first time since the fall of pro-Israel Hosni Mubarak. He told Arab League’s chairman Nabil al-Arabi during a meeting between the two: “We must help Syria so we do not allow the United States to interfere in regional affairs”.


  32. hans says:

    @paul says:
    August 11, 2011 at 6:42 am

    Well put Paul
    America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence and back to barbarism without the usual period of civilisation in between

    Anyone who the originator is, hint not me.

  33. Unknown Unknowns says:

    People in the West make the same mistake, by the way, about Imam Khomeini. They think of him as only slightly to the right of Genghis Khan, as it were, whereas the reality is that he was and remained a towering center-left figure which moved and continues to move the Iranian political spectrum towards progress. Even fyi recognizes that, I daresay.

  34. Unknown Unknowns says:


    You are exactly right to point to the spectrum of political discourse. Because you are detached from the realities of political discourse in Iran, you erroneously believe that those who maintain that the true solution to the problem of the Iranian polity is to do away with the institution of the Guardianship of the Jurisconsult – that it is *these* people who are the actual center of Iranian politics, and that there are those who hold fast to that institution that are to the right of that center, and those other than the 2nd of Khordadis and the Greens such as the religious nationalists (melli-mazhabi), the [traditional] nationalists, and socialists and communists who fall to its left. But this is a mistake, Binam. The vast majority of Iranians not only do not want another revolution; they want and believe in the institution of the Vali, and wish him every success. Imam Khomeini’s movement (nehzat) is a millenial phenomenon, in the sense that it is a change in the Shi’a religion such as has not been seen in a thousand years, and such that will not be seen for another thousand. The proof of what I maintain regarding the center of the spectrum lies in the fact that as the Leverettes have correctly pointed out (and all credit to them for their political insight) the Greens are wiped out as a political movement in Iran: they have little or no support among the masses. This is an empirical fact (for those of you in the audience who are turned on by such things). There is, of course a large opposition still, the above notwithstanding. But this opposition is united in its support of the Constitution, and specifically article 110 [Leadership Duties and Powers]. The only difference between them, as I have stated earlier, is that whereas the left sees these enumerated duties as the *ceiling* of the powers of the Leader, the right sees them as its *floor*.


    Article 110 [Leadership Duties and Powers]
    (1) Following are the duties and powers of the Leadership:
    1. Delineation of the general policies of the Islamic Republic of Iran after consultation with the Nation’s Exigency Council.
    2. Supervision over the proper execution of the general policies of the system.
    3. Issuing decrees for national referenda.
    4. Assuming supreme command of the Armed Forces.
    5. Declaration of war and peace and the mobilization of the Armed Forces.
    6. Appointment, dismissal, and resignation of:
    a. the religious men on the Guardian Council,
    b. the supreme judicial authority of the country,
    c. the head of the radio and television network of the Islamic Republic of Iran,
    d. the chief of the joint staff,
    e. the chief commander of the Isalmic Revolution Guards Corps, and
    f. the supreme commanders of the Armed Forces.
    7. Resolving differences between the three wings of the Armed Forces and regulation of their relations.
    8. Resolving the problems which cannot be solved by conventional methods, through the Nation’s Exigency Council.
    9. Signing the decree formalizing the election of the President of the Republic by the people. The suitability of candidates for the Presidency of the Republic, with respect to the qualifications specified in the Constitution, must be confirmed before elections take place by the Guardian Council, and, in the case of the first term of a President, by the Leadership.
    10. Dismissal of the President of the Republic, with due regard for the interests of the country, after the Supreme Court holds him guilty of the violation of his constitutional duties, or after a vote of the Islamic Consultative Assembly testifying to his incompetence on the basis of Article 89.
    11. Pardoning or reducing the sentences of convicts, within the framework of Islamic criteria, on a recommendation from the Head of judicial power.
    (2) The Leader may delegate part of his duties and powers to another person.

  35. paul says:

    It’s like the days of Rome.

    During the Roman empire, all roads led to Rome. Did that mean that Rome was a good place, or that it was beloved, because the talented and ambitious invariably ended up there? Of course not. Rome was merely a center of gravity, for both good and bad reasons, arguably for far more bad than good reasons. When Rome had its sword stuck into every locality, bleeding the world dry, dominating every corner of the ‘known’ world, how could any other place match its pull? So it is with places like London, New York and Washington DC today.

    People come from all over the world to America, and Americans cite this as the unquestionable evidence that America is the ‘perfect society’. The notion that America represents the Perfect Society is as insane as any notion can be, coming from the land that leads the world in inequality, in bad entertainment, bad food, an overworked populace, prison population, global warmongering, etc.. America is a land were poverty is increasingly criminalized even as 50% of the population is forced by the economy into poverty or near poverty. America is a land where children are increasingly diabetic, having been fed corn syrup based products since infancy, yet it is increasingly considered suspect for a citizen to grow a vegetable garden. One can go on and on about this. How is America possibly the ‘perfect society’? The very notion is as laughable, or lamentable, as the idea that Rome was the ‘perfect society’.

    Iran educates it’s people remarkably well. Many of those highly educated people leave for lands, like the US, where they think they can quickly join the upper classes. They go where the money is, and where there is freedom for those with money. Thus, a society, America, that fails to educate it’s children well, draws to it those who are well educated elsewhere, thereby sinking its own people deeper into poverty, who increasingly see all hope of employment outside the military disappearing, and this whole mess is cited as evidence of America’s superiority. What a flaming joke that really is.

    But America’s bayonet is stuck in every country, so who dares to laugh at the evident superiority of the Perfect Society?

  36. Unknown Unknowns says:


    “There is a rapid rerversal of this trend” [referring to brain drain].

    Indeed, not to mention that the hemorrhage has been brought about, i.e., made from what would have been a trickle to a flood, by the concerted effort of the US, in its nasty and well, just plain evil refusal to recognize the legitimate government of Iran, which by extension of course means that she does not recognize the Iranian people, i.e., sees us as something less than that. And this is the filth these brown-nosers fawn over. Only because of the US’s might. I can just hear the same type of people denigrating a third world country, say in Africa, who did not recognize Iran. But that would-be contemptuous attitude turns into a sickening fawning when it comes to the US. I wonder why? Some other psychological disease or character flaw, no doubt.

  37. Binam says:


    Reverse trend for India, Turkey and China… Iran – not so much… I don’t think a mass reverse migration will take place any time soon considering the politics of the Iranian government.

    I don’t have to prove anything to you. I know how often I am in Iran and that’s that.

    Again you’re being childish and distracting instead of adding anything new…

  38. Voice of Tehran says:

    Binam says:
    August 11, 2011 at 4:27 am

    You wrote :
    …” I for one spend more time in Iran than outside of it.”

    By default (= you are lying ) every one , who makes such a statement hasn’t been in Iran for at least 1 decade , in your case I guess it’s more than 2 decades.

    You wrote :
    …” Specially when Iran boasts the highest rate of brain drain and many a great minds now live and work outside it’s borders”…

    There is a rapid rerversal of this trend , once the last moron grasps the fact that the West is bankrupt.

  39. Binam says:


    If by centrists you mean defending the policies of the extreme right in Iran as the Leveretts have been doing then I can’t imagine who you consider a leftist or a rightist! Your political spectrum is all whacked!

    You can’t assume that anyone who disagrees with the policies of the Islamic Republic must automatically live abroad. I for one spend more time in Iran than outside of it. But I don’t look at this as a qualification to be posting here or expressing my opinion on the matters relating to the country of my birth. Specially when Iran boasts the highest rate of brain drain and many a great minds now live and work outside it’s borders… Plus considering that I am hiding behind an online ID (as you are), there’s no telling what my accomplishments are for advancement of Iranian society and culture. So instead of trying to disqualify others try to actually say something useful.

  40. Scott Lucas says:


    “I wonder if Professor Lucas is still willing to hover around London with a Blackberry in hand.”

    Thanks for the kind thought — I was doing exactly this on a High Street in Birmingham yesterday….


  41. kooshy says:

    Arnold- since you were interested on Syrian election here is the Syrian ambassador to UN discussing the elections with PressTV, one wouldn’t see that on CNN or BBC

    Syria condemns British ‘hypocrisy’


  42. fyi says:


    Blacks in UK (I assume nominally Christian) killing Muslims:


  43. fyi says:

    Unknown Unknowns says: August 10, 2011 at 8:56 pm

    Your statements below:

    “If one is not part of that system and culture (and very few in this forum are, including you, of course), then one should keep his opinions to himself, or offer them up as *suggestions* that may or may not fit the current conditions (of which the suggester is not by definition aware). ”

    Who are you to abrdige other people’s intrinsic rights to participate in the political life of their countries?

    The late Mr. Khomeini lived in Iraq; was he part of the “monarchical system” when he was urging insurrection against the Shah and his government?

    Neither you nor any spiritual or temporal authority can decide who is or is not a Muslims; who is or is not an Iranian.

    And when you call your country the “Islamic” Republic of Iran, then you have opened yourself to the whole wide world of Islam and Muslim people and their opinions.

    I have no idea what centrist mean, but for you, it means whatever the Iranian Government endorses.

    You are neglecting the individual Muslim; there lies your fault.

    The entire prophetic tradation is bout bringing people together and not alienating them from God and His Messenger.

  44. Unknown Unknowns says:


    I don’t care one way or another about any given policy, be it hijab or nuclear issues. I am a centerist, not an ideologue. What I care about is people from the outside deciding what the fate of the country should be. If one is not part of that system and culture (and very few in this forum are, including you, of course), then one should keep his opinions to himself, or offer them up as *suggestions* that may or may not fit the current conditions (of which the suggester is not by definition aware). It is not so much the *ideas* of you outsiders that is the problem (though to be fair some of them are really stupid :D ), but your hopelessly clueless *attitude*.

    Rather than your ridiculous outrage and indignation, you should first recognize you *place*, which is as a marginal first or second generation immigrant into the West, whose opinions about the country of your origin NO-ONE over there gives a damn about, and rightly so, because you are completely detached from the realities that those in positions of authority and decision-making are facing. It is only a fool like me that wastes precious time responding to your opinions, whereas what I should be doing is ignoring you and spending my time on something worthwhile. But, you are in luck, for as I see it, I wasted my time in school and look where it got me, so why not piss away my time on RFI?

  45. Rehmat says:

    Dean of the Royal Air Force College, Dr. Joel Hayward (born 1964) is being demonized by pro-Israel media for criticizing British and NATO’s invasion of Libya. That proves, like Sudan and Syria – Israel is a major player behind regime change in Libya.


  46. Unknown Unknowns says:

    I think you are right to focus on education, on women’s education and their unprecedented entry into the workforce, and the importance of these demographics shifts to the cultural development of Iran. It is indeed ironic what the Islamic Republic has been able to do in terms of raising the literacy rates, raising the participation of women in higher education and ultimately in the professions, taking back the night for urban women, and all of the infrastructure investments and improvements, be they miles of road and rail lines and water and sewer pipes laid, to number of dams and phone lines made available, to average kilowatt hour consumed, average physician per 1,000 head of population, number of calories in the average diet, etc., etc., etc. – all this compared to the “good old days” that certain clueless commenters on this site pine for, and all, furthermore, being absolute prerequisites for entering into the modern era which “the disaster” has achieved *despite* the oh-so-modern countries of the world fighting tooth and nail and doing everything it possibly can short of all out war to prevent this country from making such progress.

  47. kooshy says:

    :My dear James here is nightcap for you, which I think you should read, just after you will grasp why I say it can’t be fixed, to make it easy I took the liberty to post the entire article



    Things Fall Apart

    By William Bowles

    August 10, 2011 “Information Clearing House” — It’s fashionable to call them the ‘underclass’ that the state has buried away, out of sight–out of mind on ‘sink estates’ or trapped and invisible in the poorest neighborhoods of our cities. Demonized and/or sentimentalized by the state/corporate media (‘Shameless’ and ‘East Enders’ come to mind), exactly as in Victorian times, an entire section of the working class have been reduced to some inferior, sub-human species by the political class and its media partners-in-crime.

    “Were there a serious political opposition party in this country it would be arguing for dismantling the shaky scaffolding of the neoliberal system before it crumbles and hurts even more people.” — Tariq Ali

    I suspect the figure is probably as high as 30%, that is to say, nearly a third of the population and a great many of them under the age of twenty-five. To put it another way, the youngsters we are seeing out on the street are for the most part, the children of this 30% of the population ‘surplus to capitalist requirement’. Unemployment is especially high amongst the young and (deliberately) under-educated, especially at a time when big chunks of the ‘middle class’ are being forced back whence they came from, the working class, just like most of us.

    Just as the attack on race in the anti-immigration bill was the vehicle for the attack on the British working class, the response of the Asian, West Indian, and African population to the skinhead invasion of Southall became the vehicle for the response of the working class. Despite police protection the skinheads barely managed to escape alive. But the shortest distance between any two points is television, and the upsurge was transmitted to Liverpool, Manchester, Birmingham and city after city. From an attack on the skinheads the upsurge became a battle with police. On July 5 the police in Toxteth were driven back by integrated groups of youths. Not just driven back, the police were routed. Not just routed, the Liverpool police were outmaneuvered, outflanked, outmanned, and outfought. In desperation the police used CS gas, marking its first use in Britain outside of Northern Ireland. The Liverpool police thus proved that the real basis for the union of Northern Ireland and England exists in the subjugation of the working class of each. — ‘The Wolf Report Number 5 October 1981′ By S. Artesian

    ‘Hoodies’, gangs, ‘gun culture’ and drugs. This is how we know them, thanks to a corporate/state media that has demonized the dispossessed and unwanted. The Met police even has a special unit called Operation Trident formed specifically to deal with ‘black-on-black’ crime and gangs (Trident were also involved in the operation that led to the death of Mark Duggan who, it transpired never fired a gun and the policeman was hit by a ricocheting police bullet).

    And for thirty years they’ve kept the lid on the discontent. Dispossessed and alienated, the ‘underclass’ live in what is effectively occupied territory, occupied by a state that sees them as the enemy of all that is ‘decent’. Thus the common experience of poor, working class kids be they black or white is of the police as an occupying force and the state as indifferent, even hostile to their condition (eg, ‘welfare cheats’, ‘welfare scroungers’, ‘work shy’ et al).

    It’s interesting to note that the one, big difference between today’s uprisings and those of the 1980s is that this time, it’s no longer specifically a ‘race’ thing though race may have been the initial catalyst with the shooting death of Mark Duggan. This is fundamentally a working class uprising, albeit only its youth wing.

    There are also questions to be asked about the way the state have handled the uprisings. From the very first night it looked to me as if the police allowed buildings to burn and shops to be looted. Is it just me who got this impression? The media noticed it too but put it down to the police being caught off guard by the scale of it all.

    But I’m not convinced. I think that once the state got wind of the scale of the uprising they deliberately allowed things to get out-of-hand before launching a major occupation of those areas of our cities deemed the source of the troubles. A ‘dry run’ if you like for even greater social upheavals to come? After all, the system needs to be tested.

    It is inconceivable that local police could not have dealt with roving groups of youth, who never appear to have exceeded more than one hundred in size. An eyewitness reported from Clapham Junction as a department store was being looted that a group of police just stood by and watched.

    And, under the guise of ‘the war on terror’, all the necessary legislation is in place to ‘lock down’ entire communities, even entire towns should it be deemed necessary to ‘protect the state’:

    ‘[B]y 9:30 pm that day the ‘whole of Enfield’—just a short distance from Tottenham—had been turned into a ‘sterile area’ by the Metropolitan Police and back-up forces from Kent.’[1]

    The DoD’s report, that I am so fond of quoting from, so I might as well do it again, reasoned that rebellion would come from a newly invigorated middle class, replacing Marx’s industrial proletariat (that no longer exists in any appreciable numbers):

    “The Middle Class Proletariat — The middle classes could become a revolutionary class, taking the role envisaged for the proletariat by Marx. The globalization of labour markets and reducing levels of national welfare provision and employment could reduce peoples’ attachment to particular states. The growing gap between themselves and a small number of highly visible super-rich individuals might fuel disillusion with meritocracy, while the growing urban under-classes are likely to pose an increasing threat to social order and stability, as the burden of acquired debt and the failure of pension provision begins to bite. Faced by these twin challenges, the world’s middle-classes might unite, using access to knowledge, resources and skills to shape transnational processes in their own class interest.” — ‘UK Ministry of Defence report, The DCDC Global Strategic Trends Programme 2007-2036’ (Third Edition) p.96, March 2007 (my emph. WB)

    I am not saying that the MoD got it wrong, far from it, if anything it reinforces my belief that the state was well prepared for events. But burning down buildings and making working people homeless will not win the youngsters any friends, let alone start a revolution, adding a further rationale to my assertion that allowing the looting and burning to continue relatively unchallenged in the beginning served the interests of the political class. Hence the media’s mantras of ‘lawlessness’, ‘copycat crime’ and ‘Twitter coordinated riots’, designed to mask the desperate conditions of millions of young people who languish, ignored and forgotten in impoverished communities across the UK.

    At the root of it all is a massive number of people, I reckon at least five million, maybe more, mostly under 25 whose lives have been decimated by Capital’s latest onslaught on jobs, education, health and social welfare. An onslaught that has not been effectively challenged by what’s left of the organized working class, to their everlasting shame. Left to their own devices, and no doubt influenced by events in the Middle East and North Africa never mind Twitter, those with nothing to lose finally rose up in the only way they could, more out of a fatalistic desperation than anything else.

    Events remind me of ‘The Iron Heel’, Jack London’s prophetic masterpiece, written in 1908. It’s a future/past history of our world after a century of the Iron Heel that looks remarkably like the world of today (grab the entire novel here for free from the Gutenberg Library Project).[2]

    Outcast, demonized and their real condition airbrushed out of BBC-land, what else could they do when nobody was listening? As one participant said, “But they’re listening now”. But are they?


    1. “The scale of the police response belies claims that they were ‘taken by surprise’ by events. Not only were the notorious Territorial Support Group (TSG)—the capital’s specialist public order police unit—on standby as ‘contingency’ during peaceful protests against Duggan’s killing immediately prior to Saturday’s riots. By Sunday afternoon, thousands of police reinforcements had been drafted into Tottenham and other parts of north London from Thames Valley, Kent, Surrey, Essex and the City of London.” ‘Major police clampdown as riots spread across London and other UK cities‘ By Julie Hyland

    2. The Iron Heel describes the fall of the USA to a fascist dictatorship called the Iron Heel, a group of monopoly capitalists. Fearing the popularity of socialism (Islam?), the plutocrats of the Iron Heel conspire to eliminate democracy using their secret police and military to terrorize the citizenry.

  48. Binam says:


    Congratulations for taking up so much space with your lengthy paragraphs and yet managing to say nothing! It’s idiotic to assume what anyone who posts here has or has not done for Iran and advancement of Iranian culture. Your generalizations and your senseless defense of an idiotic law like that of the mandatory Hijab is reckless. You’re better off accepting what PG is pointing out from what appears to be a common ground – that the Iranian society is fast changing and that whether you like it or not more social freedoms are inevitable.


    Thanks for thinking so hard about my comment.

  49. Fiorangela says:

    James Canning at August 10, 2011 at 5:52 pm, re AIPAC-sponsored and paid-for trip to Israel by 81 members of US Congress —

    Phil Weiss has posted several articles concerning this troubling situation, including an article by Medea Benjamin of Code Pink.

    Not enough emphasis has been placed on the fact that American Congressmen have chosen to go to Israel at a time when the United States is in worse shape than it has been in in, arguably, its entire history.

    But NO attention has been paid to the fact that when US Congress passed legislation in 2005 in an attempt to curb gifts and travel, after AIPAC failed in its bid to carve out an exemption for travel to “America’s bestest ally,” it found a different loophole:

    Nor was that by any means the only legislation tailored to AIPAC’s wishes. Its tax-exempt fund-raising arm, the American Israel Education Foundation (AIEF), which AIPAC describes on its Web site as a “charitable organization affiliated with AIPAC,” spends the bulk of its $24 million budget paying for congressional trips to Israel. According to the Web site LegiStorm, “When Congress was working on strengthening the travel ban in 2006, reports indicated AIPAC lobbied for an exemption from the ban on lobbyist-sponsored travel. The organization did not receive a specific exemption, but the loophole on allowing non-profit travel allows the organization to continue to sponsor travel.” The non-profit AIEF simply certifies that it “does not retain or employ a registered federal lobbyist.”

    That this was no accident was confirmed, perhaps inadvertently, by Melanie Sloan of Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington. In a 2009 C-SPAN interview, host Brian Lamb asked about the 2006 travel rules adopted as a result of the Jack Abramoff scandal whereby an “institution of higher learning” can sponsor trips. “Well,” Sloan blithely responded, “this was initially even called the AIPAC exception, there was this exception that 501(c)(3) organizations and universities could, in fact, still sponsor trips.” To Lamb’s characteristic “Why?” she replied vaguely, “That was the compromise that was reached in the House. They didn’t want to ban all private travel and they thought that these were the kind of trips that were more easily explained and didn’t have the same kind of appearance of corruption.””

  50. James Canning says:


    Are you arguing that Enoch Powell was right, to say the UK was committing a form of suicide by allowing so many ‘black’ immigrants? Half a century ago.

  51. James Canning says:


    What do you mean by ‘fixing’ the problem or problems? Read Cristina Odone article that I just linked. What explains why some immigrants flourish through hard work, discipline, etc., while other immigrants work hard, are disciplined, etc., but their children or grandchildren are not disciplined?

  52. James Canning says:

    Cristian Odone has an interesting piece on the riots, and the resistance to the rioters provided by Turks, Somalis, and other immigrants.


  53. kooshy says:

    James Canning says:

    August 10, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    You ask why the looters and arsonists are doing what they are doing, in the UK. Some of it is just some fun, for the criminals. Most of the looters and arsonists have been raised without adequate ‘boundaries’ (or any boundaries, for that matter).

    James, frankly if I were you I would have stopped there and wouldn’t reveal more of the inner depth of my feelings regarding the current events in UK, what you have stated above shows what the existing problem is and why the current system is broken and unfixable. I am very familiar with situation in UK and I don’t see on long term bases it can be fixed.

  54. James Canning says:


    Did you notice the comment by ‘Cyrus’ after the PressTV story you linked (regarding Iranian government warning about travelling to UK)? He said there are 200,000 Iranians living in the UK. Most are well-educated, ‘well-to-do’, etc. Not out rioting or looting.

  55. James Canning says:


    You linked an interesting piece by Richard Silverstein, that appeared in the Guardian in January 2009. The propaganda effort he mentions the Israel foreign ministry was trying to orchestrate, on the internet (to combat bad PR in wake of Israel rampage in Gaza), probably continues to this day. American newspapers have received huge flows of letters, in years gone by, any time they allowed an article critical of Israel to be printed.

  56. kooshy says:

    Iran has warned the country’s nationals against travelling to the United Kingdom amid ongoing police brutality against anti-government protesters

    “On Wednesday, the Iranian Foreign Ministry issued a statement on its website, cautioning Iranians against visiting the UK under the current circumstances and to avoid restive places if they must make the trip due to its urgent character.

    In the message, the ministry also called on the Iranian expatriates to similarly stay away from riot-ridden spots to avoid injury and harm.”


    I wonder if Professor Lucas is still willing to hover around London with a Blackberry in hand (currently a Blackberry is an instrument of crime in the eye of the brutal British regime)

  57. James Canning says:


    Yes, an intersting element of the equation (Sikhs and Hindus doing better than non-Iranian Muslims). In the US, the ‘Vietnamese’ immigrants who came in the wake of the collapse of South Vietnam, have already shot well past the wealth and educational levels of ‘blacks’ in America. Most of these Vietnamese were of Chinese ancestry. Indian and Chinese immigrants favor states with excellent ‘public’ educational systems, and their children do better than the average ‘white’ children (academically).

  58. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 10, 2011 at 5:37 pm

    The Hindus and Sikh children do at least an order of magnitude better than the children of Muslim immigrants (exclusing Iranian Muslims).

  59. James Canning says:

    Eight-one members of the US Congress are off to visit Israel, all expenses paid by Aipac! And how attention is this story receiving in US MSN? Thanks to Philip Giraldi at Amconmag.com/blogs

  60. James Canning says:


    There are a number of Asian immigrants who have risen to great wealth and position in Britain. Some of them started with next to nothing, after being driven out of Uganda and other former British colonies in Africa.

  61. James Canning says:


    You ask why the looters and arsonists are doing what they are doing, in the UK. Some of it is just some fun, for the criminals. Most of the looters and arsonists have been raised without adequate ‘boundaries’ (or any boundaries, for that matter).

    As you may be aware, the English “grammar’ schools are available to the general public and offer higher standards of teaching and results. Poor Chinese, Indian (and other south Asian) parents do a remarkable job of getting their children into these schools. By contrast, working class white English parents do a poor job on that score. Result: Chinese children are represented at four times the level their percentage of school children would indicate. So, good for them. They see opportunity and take it. My guess is that the rioting, looting young blacks lack parents with the ability to raise their children with standards that must be met. Etc.

  62. James Canning says:


    Yes, good news re: Brazil (and relations with Iran).

  63. BiBiJon says:

    China: On Monday, the state-run news agency Xinhua raised questions about the safety of London’s 2012 Olympic Games (despite considerable safety concerns preceding Beijing’s 2008 Olympics) and a commentator at the state-run People’s Daily wrote that while Western powers have long touted Internet freedom and condemned countries like China who control the web, they’re now “tasting the bitter fruit [of their complacency] and they can’t complain about it” (there are reports that London’s riots have been partially fueled by social media). But an op-ed in the state-run Global Times today claims that Chinese news outlets have shown admirable restraint during the London riots, refraining from blaming the British for cracking down on a youth ‘revolution,’ questioning London’s ability to host the Olympics, and probing the ethnic tensions behind the unrest. The op-ed urges the British press to “stop being mean” and follow suit:

    The riot in London must have something to do with human rights abuses. But it is hypocritical to talk about human rights issues without taking into account of the context.

    These, however, are what the British and some of its media have done to China.

    They enjoy ridiculing China’s effort in improving its governance and society, often side with violent rioters and even launch official protests to the Chinese government when social conflicts break out in China.

    From http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2011/08/iran-libya-and-china-uk-riots-are-time-taunt/41062/

  64. BiBiJon says:

    CNN is reporting

    Representatives from Brazil and Iran met this week and agreed to enhance relations between the two countries, a signal that Brazilian President Dilma Rousseff will follow the example of her predecessor and demonstrate Brazil’s diplomatic independence by dealing with a nation under scrutiny for its nuclear program.


  65. Voice of Tehran says:

    Binam says:
    August 10, 2011 at 8:09 am

    You wrote:
    “The enforcement of the mandatory hijab law (which is neither Islamic or Iranian – simply Talibanesque) present the biggest conflict between the people and the government. Even Ahmadinejad knows that!”

    I was searching for the right expression to describe your above statement , I found many :


  66. kooshy says:

    James Canning says:

    August 10, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    James if the claim you make is true, then you can add why they are doing this?, what are their social and financial concerns that hasn’t been addressed yet, or do you, just like the regime in London claim all their disturbances is due to the fact that these are the immigrants that they don’t appreciate our way of life?

    All along i thought you don’t appreciate propaganda, apparently that’s bothersome, only when is coming from a certain foreign direction

    My dear jolly James there is a Persian Yazdi proverb that is very suitable for UK’s regime in London and generally entire west current situation which translate like this;
    “One should not take part in jumping over fire with a torn rectum” referring to the last post by Fara, I believe Mr. Cameron has already has already exercised jumping over the fire and is feeling the pain you know where.

  67. James Canning says:


    And I think we should bear in mind, at all times, that the object of Netanyahu is to repress the Palestinians into perpetuity. If he can. By this, I mean he is determined to try to prevent the creation of a viable independent Palestine, and he will cause the American taxpayers to spend trillions of dollars in this quest. I see the decline of America as caused in no small way, due to manipulations of Netanyahu and his crowd.

  68. James Canning says:


    Even Jews who are strong supporters of Israel right or wrong, will admit that quite a few of the senators and congressment acting like trained seals in front of Netanyahu this past May, do so because doing the bidding of Aipac etc. is the easy way to gain benefits and avoid serious problems in their careers.

    Jews in America control nearly as much wealth and power as all other groups combined.
    Half of the riches one-tenth of one percent of Americans are Jews. The incomes of this richest slice of American society has increased more than 400% in real terms (without factoring in capital gains), over the past 40 years, while the income of the bottom 90% of Americans, has declined. The US is becoming increasingly plutocratic, and the Jewish element of that plutocracy grows year by year.

    In other words, behave like a stooge for Netanyahu, and you will be rewarded.

  69. Humanist says:


    Steadily I am getting convinced “..we are witnessing an extraordinary part of the US history …”. Twenty nine (or 26) standing ovations in the joint session of congress for Netanyahu? How one can one justify (or interpret) that while the ‘speaker’ was, as many Israelis believe, a crazy warmonger?

  70. James Canning says:


    What response do you think is appropriate, by police, when dozens or even hundreds of young men are looting shops, setting fires, etc.?

  71. James Canning says:


    Yes, and how much attention is the very sensible Russian proposal, for staged reductions in the sanctions against Iran, obtaining in the US? Very little indeed. Even though it is the obvious way forward.

    A core problem, of course, is that Netanyahu and his coalition want to continue to scr*w the Palestinians. And Iran interferes with their programme of scr*wing the Palestinians.

  72. kooshy says:

    James – I am so sorry to see the head of the brutal regime in London calling the legitimate concerns of the world community Phony, don’t you?

    UK calls human rights concerns phony


  73. James Canning says:


    Bravo! Yes, we have NIEs on Iran, for 2007 and 2011. No evidence the government of Iran is trying to build nukes on the sly. And how much publicity do the stooge talking heads on American MSN give to the two NIEs on Iran?

  74. Humanist says:

    Listening to what Iranians say about their nuclear program instead of relying on “intelligence”?

    NIEs have been great for both US and Iran, crucially beneficial for both sides. Isn’t a good thing to attentively listen to those who compiled NIEs? In my view the real extremely critical problem is that the US establishment is listening to “agenda driven analysts” who directly or indirectly, intentionally or otherwise are pushing the Israel’s agenda. (Obama in his first Novrouz address to Iranians ignored 2007 NIE and repeated the old unsubstantiated Israeli lines asking Iranians to stop their activities on the path of ‘..arms…’ meaning not the defensive arms but the nuclear ones)

    After the publication of first NIE Gareth Porter told Amy Goodman something like “ [this shows] Iranians have been telling the truth all along…”. Doesn’t this imply “so far all US allegations on that issue are proven to be baseless”? Isn’t this, from any angel we look at it, an important consequential conclusion?

    This is because I believe, in the eyes of history, in the long run, the real winners were those who consistently acted forthrightly, genuinely and honorably. (acts and attitudes that are bound to benefit both sides) and the real losers were those who consistently used deceptive. destructive smf aggressive actions (who, at the least, foolishly harmed themselves and all others).

    Isn’t it time to have a close rational and analytical look at the whole Iranian nuclear issue now that Russians are proposing step-by-step measures towards the resolution of the problem? Of course it is the time since Iran is cautiously welcoming the proposal. But who on the US side is going to exploit the occasion? It is hard to be optimistic about the US attitude. Most probably the outcome is the ‘Rejection of the Russian Proposal’.

    Why I think US might reject it? Sy Hersh, after writing a six page article in New Yorker (June 6, 2011) on why “Iran is not after the bomb”, in one of his interviews said something like “ [the President doesn’t know this]….he is very isolated”. I found that opinion quite amazing…..who are those who have the power and capability to ‘isolate’ the President of USA? Disabling him from accessing the critical information he really needs?

    If Sy is right we are witnessing an extraordinary part of the US history when the legislative, judicial and executive branches are under heavy pressure from the outside.

    Quite amazing…..the question is how long this is going to last before it explodes on the face of those crazies who are pulling the behind the scene strings?

  75. kooshy says:

    “I Don’t Call it Rioting, I Call it an Insurrection”


  76. Fara says:

    On UK;

    David Cameron lectured the Chinese authorities, in November 2010, on the importance of human rights and claimed that the British government raises the human rights issues “because the British people expect us to and because we have sincere and deeply-held concerns.”

    Within just months from his lecture, Cameron describes concerns about human rights “phoney” as he orders the British police to deploy 16,000 officers only in London streets authrosing them to use rubber bullets and water cannon.

    All these come as Britain tries to present itself to the international community as a human rights defender taking the lead on setting a no fly zone on Libya or pushing for sanctions against Syria to end what it calls crackdown on protesters.


  77. Kathleen says:

    London Riots 2011: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad Finds UN Silence Hypocritical
    “”The U.N. is silent. Human rights bodies are silent,” Ahmadinejad said on state radio following a Cabinet meeting. “If one percent of this happens in countries that oppose the West, they scream until they are hoarse.”

  78. BiBiJon says:

    kooshy says:
    August 10, 2011 at 12:32 pm

    UK’s hypocrisy is well known enough. And that nerd-turf, the UN, occupied by the supine servants of colonialists, Ban and Amano, has no credibility.

    The world is a radically different place, and the world order has not caught up. These ‘disputes’, whether in Cairo, Athens, or in London, will be sorted on the streets.

  79. James Canning says:


    Rich and powerful Jews make sure that foolish American politicans who deceive the American people, to demonise Iran, are rewarded. If possible. And the reporters etc who facilitate that deception, are also rewarded. If possible. This problem continues, and is guaranteed to continue, because the relative wealth and power of the Jews in American grows year by year by year.

  80. Kathleen says:

    “This is getting ever more reminiscent of the fraudulent case for war that was laid in the run-up to America’s 2003 invasion of Iraq. And, as in that episode, the mainstream media are, to a great extent, failing to do minimal due diligence on the intelligence assessments and other official views that are so conveniently made available for them.”

    Over the last 8 years just after the illegal and immoral invasion I started keeping notes in regard to how many of the MSM host of shows allowed not only guest to repeat the unsubstantiated claims about Iran but the host themselves who repeated these claims. I heard George Stephanpolous allow McCain and Hillary Clinton to repeat that Iran had or was after a nuclear bomb. Heard Face the Nations Bob Schiefer allow Obama during the campaign repeat unsubstantiated claims about Iran. Diane Rehm has allowed Reuel marc Gerecht and others to do this. Neil Conan of Talk of the Nation allowed John Bolton to endlessly repeat these claims during several interviews. I heard Tim Russert allow Cheney to do it. Christiane Amanpour allows the claims to be repeated. All of these above mentioned never ever challenge these unsubstantiated claims.

    The very worst are you know the liberal Rachel Maddow and Fresh Airs Terri Gross. They not only have allowed guest to repeat these claims they have both repeated these claims themselves.

    What did our MSM learn about their failures in the run up to the illegal and immoral invasion of Iraq. Nothing..zip

    And on top of it when have you seen Flynt Leverett, Seymour Hersh or others who put forth verifiable information on any of these MSM outlets?

  81. kooshy says:

    Seriously UK’s regime brutality against her own citizens asking for an end to racism and a broader social equality should be condemned by a legitimate world body that excludes UK.

    British Prime Minister David Cameron has authorized the use of rubber bullets and water cannon by the Metropolitan Police to suppress the widespread protests.

    As the fourth night of angry protests shook the northwestern cities of Manchester and Liverpool, as well as Nottingham, Birmingham, West Bromwich, and Wolverhapton, Cameron announced “a fight back is under way” and “phony” human rights issues cannot prevent the British government from silencing the angry protesters.

    In November 2010, Cameron had lectured Chinese authorities on the importance of human rights and claimed that the British government raises the human rights issues “because the British people expect us to and because we have sincere and deeply-held concerns.”

    Cameron, however, has now described human rights concerns as “phony,” ordering the British police to deploy 16,000 officers on London streets alone. These officers have been authorized to use rubber bullets and water cannon.

    Britain has a bad track record on using rubber bullets against unarmed civilians which has created great concerns among rights activists and organizations. Numerous groups, from the European Parliament to Human Rights Watch, have called for a ban on rubber bullets.

    These bullets are to be used to fire at the lower parts of the body; however, there is evidence that about 19 people have been killed in Northern Ireland mostly because of rubber bullet injuries to their heads.

    Moreover, the Independent Police Complaints Commission’s revelation that no evidence of a handgun was found at the scene where Mark Duggan, the 29-year-old black, who was shot by armed police officers, was another setback in Britain’s efforts to pose as a supporter of human rights.

    All these come as Britain tries to present itself to the international community as a human rights defender taking the lead on setting a no fly zone on Libya or pushing for sanctions against Syria to end what it calls crackdown on protesters.

  82. Rd. says:

    kooshy says:

    “James here is a report of London riots by a non-establishment source”

    Some one reported; that Enduring web site was suggesting it is time to go to the UN Comedy Council and request a resolution to regime change the Cameron illegitimate government!!!!!!

    Do I hear; hear hear!!!!

  83. BiBiJon says:

    Unknown Unknowns says:
    August 10, 2011 at 8:51 am

    Right now a legitimately elected government of U.K. is grappling with deep alienation and disaffection of a segment of society.

    In the Guardian today:

    “More than 1,100 people have been arrested in centres including London, Birmingham, Manchester, Nottingham, Bristol and Leicester.”

    “Cheshire police said eight people in their area had been arrested on suspicion of inciting public disorder through the use of social media sites. One, a 20-year-old man from Northwich, has been charged with intentionally encouraging the commissioning of an offence. He is due to appear before the town’s magistrates later”

    “Courts have sat through the night to deal with criminal charges from four nights of looting and rioting in English cities.”

    Scott Lucas would be willing to spend an eternity talking about regime intimidation, censuring the internet, and kangaroo courts. But, then we have Kooshy’s link to Laurie Penny’s article.

    Just as you say, there are constructive, relevant ways of talking about the situation, and there are nebulous arguments about intangibles that are just as unprovable as they are irrefutable such as ‘modernity’, ‘Islamic catastrophe’, ‘significance of hijab’, etc. And, I agree with you, this thread too often gets hijacked. An sincere comment about education policy with tremendous significance in future societal norms,and culture gets ambushed to instead talk about my real/imagined alleged complaint about ‘modernity’.

    I ask that genuine commentators on this thread pick up the conversation. E.g. How accurate are UNESCO’s figures? How will women who constitute well over half of college graduates in Iran affect the demographics of the work place, and therefore, the gender of money earners, and in turn usher both change in and challenge for policy makers? What is Iranian society likely to look like in a generation?

  84. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Yes, I think Africom provides a much greater yield or return on investment for research as to what exactly motivated the attack on Libya than “humanitarian” considerations, particularly in light of what Louis Farrakhan had to say about what ‘Daffy was up to: Pan-African unity and playing a leading role in trying to establish a pan-African currency based on gold.

  85. Rd. says:

    Persian Gulf says:
    “Egypt is just right on the corner, . and access to what part of Africa? desert?”

    To the extend I am aware, US has been unable to obtain a suitable foot hold in Africa for its command center. Hence the africom is located in Germany!! Perhaps they don’t like the desert climate!! :-) Africa and its resources and its control is crucial and more so with Egypt on the brink to ‘break free’.

  86. fyi says:

    Unknown Unknowns says: August 10, 2011 at 8:51 am

    “…others, is chock full of problems. If you are not working *from within the system* (whether you live inside the country or not is not relevant) to solve those problems,…”

    The system that condemns Mr. Aqajeri to death?

  87. Unknown Unknowns says:

    For a while there, we had fyi & PG. And then Scott reared his head and now Binam… Well, well. Being ‘pak’ or better, heard animals, I guess Pak and Bala can’t be far behind. Look for them to come out one after the other from behind a bush.

    I think their comments that check a tendency to be excessively anti-Western, or cynical about the positive side of Western modernity are good and serve a purpose. The problem is that most of their comments simply betray a disdain and even contempt for another culture (that is no longer their own, even though they still think it is), which are written with such a caustic and acerbic tone that even the most die-hard neocon would be ashamed to use. Another problem of course is that they critique a culture that is not their own and arrogate the right to do so like the petty cultural imperialists that they are, all the while maintaining that *their* position and *their* evaluation is the correct one for *that* [Other] culture, all the while exhorting the superiority of modernity and its values; whereas of course one of the core values of modernity as it relates to international relations, one of its key insights is precisely to see that outsiders do not have a right to interfere in the internal affairs of other countries and cultures.

    This arrogance and ignorance is an outrage, and has no place in this forum. And because I do not see any chance of these people understanding anything of what I have now said, I do not see the utility of engaging them in dialogue or any sort of discourse, which is why I refrain from doing so.

    For all other Iranians and Iranophiles who *do* have ears: A revolution has taken place, which has brought about a new system of governance. This system, like any and all others, is chock full of problems. If you are not working *from within the system* (whether you live inside the country or not is not relevant) to solve those problems, then you are an outsider, and should comport yourself as such both in terms of the content and tone of your comments. Or put another way, unless you have rolled up your sleeves and are engaged in the actual work of helping the country solve the massive problems that it has (many of which are caused by the on-going efforts of alien governments of which you are so enamored), then no one is interested in what you have to say, as you do not have the requisite perspective, and as such, do not know what you are talking about – so it is best that you use your eyes and ears more than your mouth, and that you put this latter orifice to use by asking questions raised by your observations. It really is that simple.

  88. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    August 10, 2011 at 8:35 am

    Hasbara spam alert

    With Israel’s foreign ministry organising volunteers to flood news websites with pro-Israeli comments, Propaganda 2.0 is here


  89. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says: August 10, 2011 at 8:27 am

    Splendid example of why we have the government that we have in Iran.

    Each country deserves the government that she has.

  90. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    August 10, 2011 at 8:23 am

    Piss off.

  91. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says: August 10, 2011 at 8:19 am

    Instead of complaining about modernity, why don’t you try to stop the arbitrariness of the government that destroys Mulsims livelihoods?

  92. BiBiJon says:

    If only I didn’t clip my toe nails and grew my hair long, I too could be Einstein.

    Aping modernity is one way of rising from the ashes, of course. Alternatively, you might choose to spend 20.9% of a country’s total annual government expenditure on education and achieve 98.5% literacy among 15-24 year-old female youth. These numbers may well have something to do with the fact that 38% of female population of relevant age are enrolled in tertiary education in 2009 (compared to 3% in 1991) in Iran.
    Source: UNESCO http://stats.uis.unesco.org/unesco/TableViewer/document.aspx?ReportId=121&IF_Language=eng&BR_Country=3640

    It is not completely outside the realm of possibility that 1960’s South Korea raced ahead of her per-capita-income-peer, Ghana, by emphasizing public policies promoting a distinctly ‘high class’ pass time such as water fights in public parks. But, even, if true, nations should be allowed to follow their own path, unmolested by fyi & PG whose remarks fit more snugly in JihadWatch-dot-com than in RFI.

  93. Persian Gulf says:

    Voice of Tehran says:
    August 10, 2011 at 3:59 am

    I am sorry for this new development in your mindset, but I don’t see it as a radical change on my part. Instead of gross generalization, could you please explain in detail what has made you disappointed? (frankly speaking, I don’t care at all, but it would be helpful for others here, I suspect) or which part of my comments you disagree with? I am not supposed to write here to please anyone, am I? I make arguments and bring examples. if you have something to discredit, or contradict, them, I would consider them. I also don’t think I am far off from the reality of Iranian society, at least not from the generation after the revolution that I grow up with.

  94. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Good to see you’re off work early!

  95. Binam says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    If tomorrow morning the mullahs decided that they would benefit from forcing everyone to walk around butt-naked they would. The enforcement of the hijab laws is merely a political tactic to please the extremists of their base while keeping all the others — for lack of better word — annoyed.

    It is you who think Iranians are a bunch of nudist that as soon as the mandatory hijab law is lifted they would walk around naked and hold wet T-shirt concerts. You have no faith in their own social conservatism. Just as a 20 year old girl might dress conservatively in front of her dad or uncle (without actually wearing a hijab) she would dress conservatively in public as well.

    The enforcement of the mandatory hijab law (which is neither Islamic or Iranian – simply Talibanesque) present the biggest conflict between the people and the government. Even Ahmadinejad knows that!

  96. Voice of Tehran says:

    Persian Gulf says:
    August 9, 2011 at 9:05 pm

    PG , I used to be attracted to your comments in the past , but now I prefer to skip them.
    I don’t know what happened to you , but in my humble opinion you are discrediting yourself increasingly and you are lost in senseless ‘ vapouring ‘ , to my deep regret.

  97. Persian Gulf says:

    fyi says:
    August 9, 2011 at 8:17 pm

    it’s really funny to see how some people deny western advancement and consider it as an accident. they seem not to understand that many of the advances in the empirical sciences were made PURELY by freeing the minds, and practically questioning everything called as common sense, God made role….They do not see the irony of modern time of Islamic rule. people like Darwin were really lucky they did not live in an Islamic society. they would have been killed without mercy. these people’s illusion is tantamount to having a perfect society, with happiness on the peak, under the Islamic Republic. by doing what they do here, they have antagonized an absolute majority of the youth. I am 100% sure, I will see big changes in social freedom perspective within few years, or even a decade. let them be in their dream society. the force is too much to resist.

    let me bring you an example of how not having Hejab has become very common for the very relatives these people are talking about. I remember, few years ago, when social media like orkut just started to grow, women in Iran (a lot of girls that I knew) were using pics with Hejab in their profile. these days, you will have to see the pics uploaded from Iran in places like facebook. you see normal house gatherings, parties … that husbands, brothers, fathers…are present and the pics are advertised in the web openly. even websites like “alef” were complaining about this rapidly changing attitude. they gave an estimation of 9 million users under the current situation in which facebook is blocked in Iran. it’s a myth that some people here spread that women without hejab would still have restriction imposed by their relatives in the absence of enforcement for Hejab. the notion is changing even in my very religious family and yet these people are denying it altogether. when I say my family that’s a benchmark, in fact. another big change is the general passivation of religious people for imposing their norms unlike 2 decades ago that they were highly active. sometimes I think may be some people here are still living in that time period.

  98. kooshy says:

    James here is a report of London riots by a non-establishment source

    Panic on the Streets of London

    By Laurie Penny


  99. Rehmat says:

    Deputy head of Iran’s Majlis National Security and Foreign Policy Commission Hossein Ebrahimi sprayed a pinch of salt on David Cameron’s wounds on Tuesday by suggesting that Majlis should send a group of human rights rapporteurs to the UK to investigate human right violations. Iran’s Foreign Ministry Spokesman Ramin Mehmanparast also called on the British police to exercise restraint against protesters.

    David Cameron faces his ‘Arab Spring’

  100. Fiorangela says:

    Steve Inskeep must be wearing the media version of a chastity belt, and the ziocons who control media hold the key. Barney Frank threatened Inskeep’s media virtue, but Inskeep bravely rebuffed the lecherous would-be Frank talker:


    The interaction between Maid Inskeep and Cad Frank was mere flirting up to this point, when Cad Frank pressed his advantage:

    “But there is another area that I would hope we would get some agreement on. It’s something I’ve been working on. And that’s telling the rest of the world that they can no longer count on America to be their military budget, their policemen. I would begin by withdrawing from Iraq and Afghanistan at a cost of $125 billion a year.

    Maid INSKEEP [fluttering eyelashes –Sir, surely you don’t mean —]:

    You mean withdrawing more quickly and more dramatically than is already happening.

    Cad Frank: [leering lecherously, Oh, but I do –]

    “Well, withdrawing from Iraq, definitely the president is unfortunately talking about staying in Iraq at a cost of billions of dollars a year, beyond the end of this year, which would put him there longer than George Bush. And I’m hoping he could be persuaded not to do that. But in Afghanistan, while there is a withdrawal – there is a drawdown going on, there is no firm withdrawal date, and they’re talking about staying there for several more years.

    In addition to saving the 125 billion, if we were out by a few months, in both of those, as soon as you can do it in a responsible way – given the physical need to withdraw safely – it’s time for us to tell NATO that they no longer need American protection. That began in the ’40s to protect poor nations devastated by World War II from a communist threat. Everything has changed except the tens of billions of American money that goes there.”

    Maid Inskeep [tightens jaw, reminds Cad Frank that Daddy is at top of stairs w/ shotgun or Drone, as case may be]

    “Congressman, Leon Panetta, the Defense secretary, among others, have said that the defense cuts have already gone steeply enough. He would resist that along with, I am sure, a great many Republicans.”

    Cad Frank [puffing chest, swaggering; ‘Me an my boys can lick your daddy’]:

    ” I understand, although many Republicans now are starting to move in this direction. Obviously, I and the Tea Party disagree on a number of issues, but a significant number of them are willing to break with an establishment view that it somehow is America’s responsibility to guard the whole world. I know Panetta says that. I was disappointed because – I guess you become secretary of defense, and that’s your institutional responsibility.”

    cue the organ music: DUH DA DAAAAA:

    Cad Frank makes his move:

    There is no justification for America protecting Western Europe against nonexistent threats. There is no justification for us building anti-missile defense systems in Poland and the Czech Republic to protect them against nonexistent attacks from Iran.

    Maid Inskeep [atremble with fear & indignation, reminds Cad Frank where the party line is drawn, surely an impregnable defense]:

    “Congressman, if I can, we’ve just got a few seconds. You have mentioned defense spending. You’ve mentioned tax increases. Those are two areas of disagreement. The biggest part of the federal budget is entitlements… “

    Cad Frank [brushing aside Maid Inskeep’s objection like a fruit fly drunk on Raid]:

    “No, wrong. I’m sorry. The defense budget is bigger than Medicare, and Social Security is, in fact, self-financing, still is. “

    Maid Inskeep [clutches pearls in near faint. Tongue swipes parched lips, beads of perspiration chafe chastity belt. Play for time; Deflect, reassert your virtue, ANYTHING to regain control]:

    “Let’s stipulate for this conversation: a very, very, very, very, very big part of the budget is entitlements. Democrats are seen as resisting cuts. Is your side – in a couple of seconds – going to appoint people to this special committee who are ready to make a deal?”

    Cad Frank [with Rhett Butler cool]:

    “I disagree with you that in terms of draining on the budget, Social Security is largely as self-financed…and the military budget is larger than Medicare. So demonizing entitlements and saying that – in fact, here’s the deal…”

    [Whereupon Maid Inskeep, blushing Scarlett, plays the Cinderella trick]

    “Congressman, I really have to cut you off there. But I do…”

    To which our Cad retorts Frankly, Maid Inskeep, I don’t give—; naah, REWRITE

    [Cad Frank upbraids Maid Inskeep for leading him on]:

    “Well, I wish you wouldn’t ask me complicated questions with five seconds to go.”

    [Maid Inskeep, realizing that preserving chastity is one thing but eating 3 meals a day is another, pledges to Think About It Tomorrow]:

    “We’ll come back and bring you back for more. Always a pleasure to talk with you.”

    In spite of the fact that Maid Inskeep was able to flee the intrigue with her virtue intact, she left behind a Glass Slipper of shattering import:

    -Iran is not a threat to anybody
    -America’s foreign policy is breaking the United States
    -Barney Frank knows it
    -So do the American people

  101. fyi says:

    kooshy says: August 9, 2011 at 5:58 pm

    Are you daft man?

    The Iranian Government banned the Iranian Travel Agencies from offering foreign tours during the memorials for this or that Imam.

    Thus the Iranian Government, wanting to force down people’s throat their low class religiosity, derprived a group of Muslim Iranians from earning money.

    While the Iranian Muslim Tour operators were idle, the foreigners (some Muslim, some Christian) came and offered similar tours and similar Iranians left Iran to avoid forced reliosity of that country; avoiding Nekbat Eslami.

    Shame, shame, shame.

    What price Islamic Disaster?

  102. kooshy says:

    James Canning says:

    August 9, 2011 at 5:26 pm

    “Didn’t Chairman Mao cause the deaths of maybe 50 million Chinese, with his hairbrained schemes of one sort or another?”

    Oh my dear James, if you rather to play this number game on this past century’s figures , than may I suggest, to simplify we add the human casualties from the two European wars of WW1 and 2 and subtract that from the Mao’s number and see who comes ahead.

    BTW- the telegraph Link you posted no longer work the story is not there anymore, I may as well listen to BBC and get the real news, LOL.

  103. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Yes, but I know how the massacre in Bahrain could have been stopped. I’m not going to name any names, but its initials begin with US 5th fleet!

    But I mean do you *really* believe these guys are spending billions of dollars of tax payer money to save a bunch of “rag-heads” as said tax payers refer to them as, generally speaking? Really?

  104. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    How the mission so quickly creeped toward ‘regime change’ has not been clearly established. In Libya. I of course think it was an appalling blunder. But others whose views I regard favorably generally, argue that taking out Gaddafi was essential.
    I think gradual evolution, with the existing gov’t of Libya, was the best way forward. Provided the ‘massacre’ could have been averted.

    I am not sure how the slaughter in Rwanda could have been controlled or stopped.

  105. Fiorangela says:

    Jason Ditz reports on plans for Libya. http://news.antiwar.com/2011/08/08/uae-would-occupy-tripoli-in-post-gadhafi-libya/

    “the “Tripoli task force,” a 15,000-man force operated by the United Arab Emirates which will, after Gadhafi is out of power, occupy the capital city of Tripoli and conduct mass arrests of Gadhafi’s top supporters.

    The arrests won’t stop there, as of course they never do for a regime looking to stifle dissent. Indeed the plan also includes discussion of a new state radio network that will broadcast orders to the public to support the new government, and warning anti-Gadhafi factions that haven’t endorsed the new regime to stand down. The assumption in the report is that these factions, termed a “fifth column,” would also be arrested. The new state media will of course be necessitated all the more by the NATO attacks on the existing media.”

    Made me think that the US-France-GB wrote another “Balfour Declaration” with UAE the beneficiary.

    imo the original Balfour, in which GB gave what was not it’s to give, in satisfaction of a debt that GB owed but could not pay; Rothschild paid the debt, GB paid off with other people’s land.
    My conspiracy theory re Libya is US ‘rented’ its air force to Saudi Arabia, in collusion with France & GB; US got cash from SA [remember, this is tinfoil territory]; other Arab states who gave assent to the operation, necessary to give the invasion and takeover of Libya credibility among Arabs, collect their prize/price: control of Tripoli.

    The world is still cleaning up after the inglorious denouement of the British empire.

  106. Persian Gulf says:

    Rd. says:
    August 9, 2011 at 4:24 pm

    well, I thought about that possibility too. but it seems very unlikely. Egypt is just right on the corner, and the struggle among different tribes might have lasted for years as we are going to see anyway. and access to what part of Africa? desert? if there is a strong gov. in Libya that is willing to provide oil and gas normally, why bother breaking it up specially with a country of just 5 million? I am a bit suspicious of Chines infiltration. however, don’t have any info about the subject.

  107. Unknown Unknowns says:


    I’m curious to know what your opinion or best guess is as to why Britain & France/ NATO/ US decided to push the case for a no-fly zone over Libya at the Security Council. If you accept or basically accept what they say at face value (which, as I understand it, is that its purpose was/ is to prevent a massacre), i.e., that it is basically a humanitarian gesture, then OK. But then, how do you explain the fact that these countries, who are ostensibly so concerned about human life, (a) turn a blind eye to much worse tragedies, such as we had in Rwanda, (b)kill somewhere between 500,000 to 1 million civilians, more than half of which were children, and (c) kill as many if not more civilians in the process of “protecting” civilians as ‘Daffy had threatened to kill (which he would not of been stirred into action had the Western allies not wound up and goaded the “rebels” in the first place. And then, how do you explain mission creep and the theft of all of Libya’s foreign currency reserves? I’m just asking, as I honestly would like to know. I would love to live in a world where the West never lied – a world where your view on this particular situation would be that of a realist and not naive, and mine would be cynical and jaded and not realistic, you know?

  108. kooshy says:


    “Why Iranians Love to travel to Thailand and Turkey?

    Answer (see comments section in Persian): Because those countries treat people with respect, do not gouge the travelers, and do not have moral police. ‘”

    No, the answer is more simple, the real answer is variety, perhaps after traveling to Mecca (2 million per year), Iraq (5 million per year) or Mashhad (20 million visitors per year), like all the other people in the world some Iranians like to go to party in Turkey and Thailand, yet others will like to go for pilgrimage to Iraq or Mashhad, is that your reasoning to prove that majority of Iranians hate their country’s rules, and social traditions (regardless if in your opinion is good or bad), to be honest as a nonreligious person I myself prefer to go to Turkey for vacation, rather than going to Mecca, but that doesn’t mean majority thinks like me.

  109. Fiorangela says:


    Scott Horton Anti War Radion — reacting to possibility that H Clinton will recognize MEK.

  110. James Canning says:

    Chairman Mao’s harebrained schemes killed maybe 50 million Chinese. (Not hairbrained)

  111. James Canning says:


    Telegraph has good coverage of the riots. And I recommend Ed West’s comments (‘British society could learn a lot from the Turks of Dalston’).


  112. James Canning says:


    Didn’t Chairman Mao cause the deaths of maybe 50 million Chinese, with his hairbrained schemes of one sort or another?

    By ‘genocide’ by Europeans in the 17th Century, are you referring to the Thirty Years’ War?

  113. James Canning says:


    Isn’t the more important question why some people would think it is a good thing to have black people using guns to prey on each other. This is what was the purpose of the police operation in which the young man was killed.

  114. James Canning says:


    Gaddafi warned several European leaders last year that he would ‘drown’ Europe with sub-Saharan Africans, if he did not get more help controlling his borders. And you think these same countries would want to make it easier for uncontrolled emigration to Europe?

  115. masoud says:


    “Why is it that Jews are no longer admitted to the Iranian Universities to study medicine?”

    Why do you feel justified in inventing these stories out of whole cloth?

  116. Rd. says:

    Persian Gulf says:

    “Another argument for Libya’s mission, “

    It is also possible that the intent was not to “free” Libya rather to break it up. It would be much easier to control the area and access to Africa with competing tribes controlling different parts of Libya. Nato / US played their dirty game, but perhaps MQ had read their hands.

  117. Fara says:

    A ‘tit for tat’ :-)

    A senior Iranian lawmaker says Iran’s Majlis (parliament) is ready to send a group of human rights rapporteurs to the UK to investigate human rights violations in the country.


  118. kooshy says:

    James it seems to me that London is not welcoming the chicken’s home coming, I think is shameful that a so called liberal news organization is distastefully dismissing the international community’s concerns on the safety of the UK demonstrators. What do you think my jolly good man?

    Iran – topping the world schadenfreude league

    The international reaction to the UK riots


  119. kooshy says:


    “Let us assume that the early Muslims had in fact contributed to the emergence of the empirical sciences in Europe.

    So what?

    What have the Muslim done since 1100?”

    The answer was already in this sentence in my previous post which I repeat here and that goes for every civilization

    “true that the Persians learned from the Greeks , Chines , Indians , they still do and nothing wrong with that after all we all have learned from the prior civilizations”
    We still do, indecently you and PG might want to focus on the meaning of the word “empirical” perhaps than you will find a better answer to your question.

  120. fyi says:

    Voice of Tehran says: August 9, 2011 at 2:15 pm

    Thank you for the comments.

    May I direct you to the section of the text where it reads:

    “…keeping its false conflation of (the humansit) Church and State by failing to jettison the dynamic of imposing its system on others and yes, failing to provide adequately for minority rights …”

    Where, pray tell me, and in which Muslim-majority country do Muslims respect and uphold, on a consistent legal manner, the rights of such minorities as Bahais, Christains, Jews, Zorastrians, Ahmadis, Sikhs, Yazids, Druze and many others?

    Why is it that Jews are no longer admitted to the Iranian Universities to study medicine?

    And certainly not into the Armed Forces?

    And I am not going to even mention the Bahais – however misguided they may be from a religious point of view.

    Physician, heal thyself!


    Why Iranians Love to travel to Thailand and Turkey?

    Answer (see comments section in Persian):Because those countries treat people with respect, do not gouge the travelers, and do not have moral police.


  121. fyi says:

    kooshy says: August 9, 2011 at 2:41 pm

    You are wrong and all you need to so is to study the history of the Medieval Christian Philosophy.

    Let us assume that the early Muslims had in fact contributed to the emergence of the empirical sciences in Europe.

    So what?

    What have the Muslim done since 1100?

  122. kooshy says:

    fyi says:

    August 9, 2011 at 1:01

    If so,then you must agree that human’s scientific developments are a chain link that cannot be only attributed to one or a specific group of people as they have been circulating and moving around the planet based on one’s accumulation of wealth ( for example in northern Europe after the discovery of the new continent, or for the Arabs when they captured a wealthy Iran, or today in China), if that’s correct than many inventions of the Europeans would not have been possible without precise calculation in algebra, or the learning of Muslims in medicine which came to Europe via Spain, true that the Persians learned from the Greeks , Chines , Indians , they still do and nothing wrong with that after all we all have learned from the prior civilizations, true this is also part of our evolution that one who don’t believe in “creation” should believe. Muslims have every right to be proud of their achievements in science and humanities. May be is easy you write of the history, but history is where it all begins, like Truman said is foolish to ignore the history or even to limit it.

    James – never in history of mankind slavery was formulated and conducted in an institutional scale that was done by the Europeans in 15, 16, 17 centuries. Same goes for genocide.

    James – insted give us a bit of news on how’s London coming alone these days.

  123. Voice of Tehran says:

    @ fyi
    Please show yourself to a medical specialist , your are insane…
    Here is a post from our esteemed UU ( Feb.2011) , in reply to another insanity on your part , where you titled the IRI as ” NEKBAT ” , read it carefully.

    “””I tried unsuccessfully to come up with a concise response to your position that Iran’s revolution and its aftermath, the current regime/ situation is a catastrophe (nekbat, I beleive was the word you used). The impetus driving my desire to respond to you is that while I agree that there are so MANY errors that this government has made and continues to make, and consequently, so much room for improvement, many of these problems which are acutely felt on the individual level, in the big picture, on the societal level, if you will, these issues are inconsequential relative to the seismic shift which has taken place as a result of Imam Khomeini’s (or “Mr. Khomeini’s”, if you prefer) revolution, which was the creation of a whole new social order distinct from the order of the ancien regime, which was an appendage of the failed attempt by the universalist ethos of the En”light”enment project to create and maintain a global world order based on the absurd notion that European secular humanist values of the 18th century can and will inevitably obtain and triumph throughout the world. As absurd as this project sounds once viewd in this light, this is, nonetheless, precisely what has been happening since the revolutions of 1776 and 1789: because of the vast superiority of the West in terms not only of technological and hence military superiority, but also in terms of political, economic, and in a word, intellectual superiority – all of which was (and continues to be, to a lesser and lesser extent by the decade) an historical anomoly which brought about by unique historical circumstances* and which, by its very nature, could not and cannot outlast the natural order of things, which is, of course, parity.
    *(1) The invention c. 1450 by Johannes Gutenberg of the modern printing press, (2) The Portugese invention of the three-mast sail ship, necessitated by the fall of Constantinople in 1493 (? close enough) and the consequent cutting off of Rome and Europe from the Silk Road Trade, so that then backwater civilization of Western Christianity had to find a way to go *around* ‘Islamdom’ (to use Marshall Hodgson’s awkward but inescapable neologism), leading to (3) the discovery of the Americas, and the boon provided Western Christendom by the injection of vast and unimaginable amounts of gold and even more importantly, land and slave labor, both local and imported, into its economy, as well as precious commodities such as the horse, the potato, maize, tobacco, etc. (4, 5 & 6) Guns, Germs & Steel (see jarred Diomond’s book of the same name), (7) Martin Luther’s reformation of the liturgical language of from the mysterious to the vernacular, et cetera – for a more nuanced account, see Hodgson’s Venture of Islam, Volume 3.
    But I digress. The important point to focus on is that this New World Order which the humanists maintain (and the Transhumanists are trying to transcend?), was and remains based on the order it reacted against, namely that of the Holy Roman Empire, with its so-called conflation of Church and State, so-called, because it only becomes a conflation (and this is the crux of the biscuit) when that unified system of governance and cultural ethos (1) does not have a mechanism to accommodate minority rights (puritan{ical} inquisitions, the purging of Moslems and Jews from the Iberian peninsula in post-Andalusian Spain), and (2) Feels the need to impose its religion on others (the Crusades, Manifest Destiny & teh White Man’s Burden, Colonialism, Neo-Colonialism {WTO/IMF/World Bank/ GATT/ NAFTA/ Trilateralism, etc.}).
    So the “secular” humanist project took over this regime, if you will, with its monist (universalising) axiology (ethical system), and simply replaced the head of this beast, which was the Cathiolic Church, with a human one – keeping its false conflation of (the humansit) Church and State by failing to jettison the dynamic of imposing its system on others and yes, failing to provide adequately for minority rights (the Supreme Court Decision in teh last decade of teh 19th C which split the Mormon Church by disallowing polygamy, the exigency (maslahat) of the state not being able to accommodate the use of the Peyote plant as a sacred native American ritual, or much more mundane matters as not allowing the call to prayer at, say, 5 AM, as it violates municipal noise ordiances, etc.)
    Well, as you can see, the concept is comlex and I am again failing to do justice to it. But the point is, Iran’s revolution is a force of nature, a symptom, if you will, of teh natural tendency to repulse this immanentising or to use a word you favor, “utopian” fanstasy of a universal, monist world order based on a secular humanist 18th century (Age of Reason) ideology.
    In this – larger – context, where the heirophant has woken, has BEEN awakened by Imam Khomeini, from its millenial slumber and risen to dam the imposition of the tide of alien and godless culture, the grievances of a minority of the population, as legitimate and acute as they may be (and I believe that they are both, and my heart goes out to the desparation of these “greens” who have been marginalized), these grievances must by necessity be small potatos as the techtonic plates of history shift and the seismic wheels grind up the monist fabric to a pulp, bringing forth a plurality of cultures and religions. The *radicality* of the Event of the Islamic Revoution and the concomitant changes to the landscape (be it cultural, political, aesthetic) and the need and indeed sacred duty to ensure its survival in a sea of unbelief, imposed wars both hot and cold, sanctions, internal sedition, intense Balkanization pressures, etc. – all these elements and the exigencies that necessarily must follow in their train, the lesser and otherwise excellent mind of Ayatollah Hosyan Ali Montazeri did not understand, and cooler minds who shared his concerns and values prevailed, alhamdulillah. May the peace and blessings of God be with the pure soul of that late great ayatollah, as well as with the pure but lost soul of the the recent martyr of 25 Bahman who was pictured with the Ayatullah al-Uzma.
    To the contrary, dear fyi, and with due respect (of which there is much indeed), the advent of Imam Khomeini and the adumbration of the Revolution in its many stages and phases (la tarkabunna tabqan an tabaq), while inconvinient and even opressive to many, is not a “nekbah”, is not a catastrophe. Indeed, it is a blessing most glorious from the One who stated in the Surat an-Nuh that it would be easy for Him to create a world with one religion if He so wished. But in His infinite Wisdom and Mercy, He create a world with a multiplicity of religions (a world where ethical values do NOT have universal application, a *pluralist* world order), so that different nations could compete and exceed each other (sebqat) in doing good.

  124. James Canning says:


    To be fair to Obama, the foolish US Congress forces him to squander huge sums on useless or unnecessary weapons.

  125. James Canning says:


    Is Lowther representative of ‘current US thinking’? I sure hope not. But Obama continues to squander hundreds of billions of dollars on useless or unnecessary weapons, including more nukes.

  126. James Canning says:


    In The New York Times Feb. 8, 2010, Adam Lowther argued that Iran’s possession of nuclear weapons would enable the US to break the Opec oil cartel! Astonishing rubbish!

    Lowther must be on the take from nuclear weapons manufacturers.

  127. Persian Gulf says:

    kooshy says:
    August 9, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    but for you, who is in empirical sciences himself to deny western achievements is really shocking. the last 300-400 years are important bc we have had an exponential jump in human achievements, science, technology, human sciences, …. I always discuss these with a British colleague of mine. Newton’s ideas were discussed in academia openly. look at the Muslim world. Aghajari at beginning of 21 century is condemn to death for say something very mild. I dare to say the muslim world was always like this, even worse for centuries. and the importance of communications, turbine…can’t be denied. it was the continuity, that requires a culture and environment to swallow all these changes, not an accident of history that resulted in empirical sciences, as an example, to flourish. what Islamic world had was more of a sporadic attempt here and there that was often destroyed by another zealous tribe or despot.

    don’t have time now to write more. but you guys are amazing. one really can’t say human suffering in the Muslim era was less. least of them racism, exploitation….

  128. James Canning says:


    David Gardner had a thoughtful piece in the Financial Times today on the situation in Syria, and the course of events he expects. The Saudis obviously were very unhappy when Rafiq Hariri was assassinated. and was that killing related to the desire of the group that surrounds the Syrian president, to keep their lucrative foothold in Lebanese business?

  129. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 9, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    The man is representative of current US thinking.

    I do not know his affiliation but this article might also be an attempt at saving fundings for US nuclear weapons labs.

    Really, this is the best that the Axis Powers’ policy makers can do, “we have 3400 war-ships” and “10,000 nuclear warheads” that can annihilate all life on this planet.

  130. James Canning says:


    Fun comment. It is true that many of the captains of the ships conducting Islamic slaving raids in the Mediterranean, were Christians from northern Europe.

  131. James Canning says:


    Is Adam Louther an idiot? In the piece you linked, dated Aug. 5th, he claims the US needs more nukes ‘to guarantee national sovereignty’! Astonishing cr*p!

    A Quote: ‘For these men [leaders of North Korea and Iran], nuclear weapons are a logical option as they attempt to deter American aggression.’ So, there is a risk to NK that the US will launch an invasion from SK? Utter lunacy.

  132. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 9, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    You are wasting your time.

    Muslims were living pure lives before the bad bad bad ugly ugly perfidious Albion (the Little Satan) and later US (the Great Satan) destoryed their Utopian Order of Existence.

  133. James Canning says:


    Are you claiming that Muslims did not have slaves, deal in slaves, capture people to enslave them, etc.?

  134. fyi says:

    kooshy says: August 9, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Quite franklym, I think a people who have, collectively, produced nothing of value in any field of human endeavour for 500 years, should shut-up and sit at school benches and learn to learn from their betters – in this case the Western Civilization.

    Yes, the Western Civilization absorbed many intellectual and artistic products of the Mulsim world, but so had Muslims when they were a creative people in the first 4 centuries after Hijra.

    But, and now pay attention here, the development of (Western) empirical sciences – its chief acheivement – owed nothing to the world of Islam – it was entirely home-grown in Europe. It evolved out of the philosophical investigations of Christian Monastic orders.

    Really, instead of denigrating Western Christian Civilization I suggest you and others studying her in a deep manner.

    Why isn’t Islamic Republic of Iran send students to study the work of Medieval Christian Thinkers such as Willian of Ocam (sic.) or Bonnaventure?

    Why is not any Iranian seriously studing US history – per chance they might learn something about how the Great Statan became so great?

    I tell you why.

    Laziness and inwardness.

  135. fyi says:

    Unknown Unknowns says: August 9, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    In 1700 Islamdom, as you put it, was wallowing in arbitary rule, despotism, ignorance, stupdity, and squalor; conditions that had not changed much since 1200.

    Go thank God for Messers. Khomenin and Tabatabaie to drag (Shia) Muslims yelling and screaming into a new world.

  136. kooshy says:


    “What have you Muslims done over the last 200 years that has benefited anyone?”

    Well, one can also argue what the Muslims didn’t do or were incapable of doing in a way was more beneficial to the world than the sum of what westerners did, like the slavery, colonization, racism, mass scale genocide, and world wars to name a few.

    Then the second and more important question is why do you need to make an artificial scale of just 200 years , what is the benefit of arguing just this last 200 years instead of the whole man’s civilization, frankly that’s a bit insecure of you to limit the debate to what secures your innuendo. Somehow you may expand the argument by lowering some of that orientalism thinking.

  137. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Like I said a couple of months ago, I’m through having serious discussions with you. But I guess I can still have a little fun.

    Your question betrays, as BiBiJon’s counter question revealed, exactly the kind of Johnny-Come-Lately attitude and convenient historical amnesia I was talking about. Why do you limit the scope of the discussion to 200 years. And its 300 years, if you must know. Marshall Hodgson, the authority that stands head and shoulders above all other historians on the subject, puts 1700 as the date when the scale was tipped in favor of European primacy in the sciences, technology, administration, etc. He also is adamant that this change came about as a result of *historical accident*, and maintains that it could as easily happened in China (and very nearly did). Hodgson was a devout Quaker, may God rest his soul.

    For a thousand years (700 – 1,700) Islamdom was the uncontested vanguard of human progress. After a glorious millenium the likes of which had never been seen in the history of the world, the Sorcerer rested. Then the Sorcerer’s Apprentice started meddling with things that he knew naught about, and turned science in the service of God and His Bondsmen initially into science for its own sake, and gradually and inevitably, science in the service of money and power.


    The moral of the story is that the Apprentice (The West) was not sufficiently prepared, but in his ignorant arrogance, forged ahead, like an angry teenager rebelling against the authority of his parents and that of society at large. At first, as can be seen in the video, things went well. There were “scientists and thinkers” or whatever. But then things started to go wrong, badly wrong.

    As William Golding said of the ending of his *Lord of the Flies* (which depicted exactly what happens when authority is suddenly cast aside {it rapidly degenerates into the law of the jungle and the primacy of brutish force} – he likened the fate of man to that of the schoolboys stranded on that island, with the difference that (he believed, in a pessimism which borders on nihilism and which I do not share) ,no ship of rescue will be coming for man.

    The adolescent rebellion against the authority of tradition, which at first seemed such a good idea, turned into the killing fields of the War of 1914, which finally woke the adolescent up from its Victorian denial. That war 31 years later with the earth-shaking dual explosions at Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which were, thank God, loud enough to wake the apprentice up from *his* centuries old slumber.

    And that is where we are today, where the denial of the Apprentice has reached such heights that it cannot be characterized as such any longer. After all, denial is a psychological state of a relatively sane and stable mind. The Apprentice is far from that. Those elements of his psyche which hold fast to tradition are denigrated, marginalized and on the wane, others are wandering around in theistic and atheistic existential halls of mirrors, and the delusional and drunk with power are ascendant, so that it dares to address the Old Sage, the Sorcerer, with questions such as “So what have *you* done in the last 200 years?”

    While it is true that the world of Islam has been asleep for the past 300 years, and that its response to the technological and yes, axiological changes brought about by the phenomena later collectively labeled ‘modernity’, – and more than that! what am I saying?? Imam Khomeini was *right*, damn it! The ‘ulama of the Ahl as-Sunna wa’l Jama’at basically sold out to power from Day 1, and by so doing allowed the separation of Mosque and State to become effective in Islam from the beginning of the 8th century, and the learned among the Shi’at ‘Ali spent a thousand years in their ivory castles waiting for the return of the Guided One, al-Mahdi – while all that is true, yet, yet, in all this, the Sorcerer is still the Sorcerer and the Apprentice the Apprentice – for the Sorcerer was mature enough to recognize the primacy of a God-centered existence and the blight of deviations from His path, while the Apprentice… well, we all know about the apprentice. We are all stationed at the edge of the Abyss to which his mischief has brought us all ajma’een (in our collectivity).

    fyi: you are of course free and are welcome to respond to this if you want to, but please do not expect me to respond back. Like I say, I am through with discussing anything with you here, as we do not have sufficient common ground, let us just say, for any conversation to bear fruit. This post was more for the benefit of BiBiJon, VoT, Nahid, and whomever else might benefit from what little wisdom it might contain. Wa’llahu ‘alam.

    Allahumma salli ‘ala Mohammad va aal-e Mohammad.

    Wa’llahumma, ajjal liwaleyk al-faraj.

    Ameen. Ameen. Ameen.

    Subhaan Allah, wa’stakhfir Allah, wa la ilaha illa’llah.

    La howlu wa la quwwatu illa bil’lah

    Ma’ sha’llah.

  138. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    August 9, 2011 at 11:02 am


  139. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says: August 9, 2011 at 10:45 am

    “..western self-absorbed grandstanding, attributing anything and everything to themselves (in popular/political/media culture) as if their civilizations’ predecessors didn’t even exist.”

    Muslims are even more self-absorbed than Westerners.

    Where are the Muslim Scholars of American culture and history?

    Where are those Iranian experts in Chinese Culture & Civilization?

    Who among Muslims is studying Buddhism?

    Furthermore, Muslims are using all the fruits of teh Western Civilization that you and UU so denigrate: medicine, internal combustion engine, jet ariplanes, viagra, aspisin etc.

    Yes, why indeed confine myself to the last 200 years.

    Really one should go back 400 years.

    But I was reminded of Mullah Sadra and Miraz Shirazi (innovator in Ijtihad).

  140. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    August 9, 2011 at 10:23 am


    It ain’t a court, and I’m no attorney.

    What UU wrote is an apt description of western self-absorbed grandstanding, attributing anything and everything to themselves (in popular/political/media culture) as if their civilizations’ predecessors didn’t even exist.

    As to your what have they done last 200 years, before I dignify such a question with an answer, let me ask why frame the question to the last two centuries?

  141. Scott Lucas says:


    “A great academic and scholar like Scott Lucas”

    I thank you….

    S. (one of the “rabble and common folk” in Birmingham)

  142. fyi says:

    BiBiJon says: August 9, 2011 at 9:59 am

    Why, are you his attorney?

    My point stands; that post was a silly denigration of the Western Civilization.

    If I were Western, I would only develop contempt for its author.

    And my questions stands:

    “What have you Muslims done over the last 200 years that has benefited anyone?”

  143. BiBiJon says:

    fyi says:
    August 9, 2011 at 9:38 am

    “fair” was UU’s overly generous depiction of your comments.

  144. fyi says:

    Unknown Unknowns says: August 9, 2011 at 6:13 am

    This is stupid.

    I mean all cultures have quirks and peculiarities that might seem odd or silly to foreigners.

    But the Europeans had Thinkers, Composers, Scientists, Philosophers, Novelists, Scholars of Foreign cultures.

    What did the Muslims have at that time?

    Just that pathetic Al Afghani and Seyyed Qutb, both of them non-thinkers.

    And Bab and Abdul Baha were their best response to Modernity.

    One has to be fair.

  145. Rehmat says:

    In 2008, in an interview Senator Joe Lieberman gave to Israeli daily Ha’aretz, said: “Why lovers of Israel should vote for McCain – because he is the candidate most likely to thwart a nuclear Iran“.

    Lieberman: ‘We need more wars for Israel’


  146. BiBiJon says:

    Unknown Unknowns says:
    August 9, 2011 at 5:47 am

    Fascinating about Artemisa. I wonder if you know whether her name (I take it Artemisa is the Greek form of the name) has survived to the present day, and what the contemporary Persian form is?


  147. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Your historical insight just goes to add yet another proof of what I call the Johnny-Come-Lately syndrome the insufferable West suffers from. I mean here is a culture who three or four generations ago, at the height of the Victorian era, used to cover the “legs” of their pianos with special doilies made for the purpose of veiling those provocative legs, lest their men-folk get too excited and carried away. Here is a culture whose supposed greatest thinkers around that same time were seriously debating the question of whether or not women had souls. Here is a culture who not one century ago treated women as the property of men, with no right to own property let alone businesses. And they have the gall (or unmitigated audacity as Frank would say) to tell a nation much older than their whole civilization that our women folk cannot compete in international soccer unless they expose parts of their body which only their husbands and close kin are privy to. I mean, at this rate, the next thing we’ll be told is that they will have to play soccer braless, or better yet, topless. After all, that *is* the want of unrestrained lust, isn’t it?

    And then there are fools in this very forum whose sense of identity is so lost in their westoxication that they *indignantly* doth rant and protest against their own heritage. What can one say to such a man but: ‘there’s nothing worse than a house nigger.’ ?

    But talking of doilies, here’s another excellent lyric from Frank, brought to you by your friendly neighborhood Ayatoller of Rock’n’roller:

    Evelyn, a modified dog
    Viewed the quivering fringe of a special doily
    Draped across the piano, with some surprise

    In the darkened room
    Where the chairs dismayed
    And the horrible curtains
    Muffled the rain
    She could hardly believe her eyes

    A curious breeze
    A garlic breath
    Which sounded like a snore
    Somewhere near the Steinway (or even from within)
    Had caused the doily fringe to waft & tremble in the gloom

    Evelyn, a dog, having undergone
    Further modification
    Pondered the significance of short-person behavior
    In pedal-depressed panchromatic resonance
    And other highly ambient domains…

    Arf she said

    An excellent (alas instrumental) rendition of the melody can be heard here:


    (click on the first entry, on the title to the left rather than on ‘lyrics’ on right)

  148. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Fascinating about Artemisa. I wonder if you know whether her name (I take it Artemisa is the Greek form of the name) has survived to the present day, and what the contemporary Persian form is?

  149. Reza Esfandiari says:


    I haven’t yet seen any unrest in Manchester where I am based, but am going down to London today so I meet see what is really going on. It does seem like the death of Mark Duggan has become a spark to ignite a wider sentiment of outrage and disaffection. In this respect, it is similar to the death of Mohammad Bouazizi in Tunisia.

    Scott is safely living in his ivory tower. He doesn’t venture amongst the rabble and common folk – they are beneath the status of a great academic and scholar like him.

  150. BiBiJon says:

    This reminds me of that

    Royal Navy appoints first female warship commander

    Navy breaks 500-year taboo by giving Lt Commander Sarah West command of HMS Portland


    Women in the ancient world By Joyce E. Salisbury

    Artemisia, Admiral in the Persian Navy 480 BCE.

  151. Voice of Tehran says:

    Sakineh Bagoom says:
    August 8, 2011 at 11:20 pm
    kooshy says:August 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm

    “Having learned from Iranians “silent” protests, he has joined the protesters silently; maintaining silence here as well.”

    Yes in deed , same *Well* informed sources who saw the good professor being whipped in that location(mentioned earlier) in downtown London , made the strange observation , that he was silent , however from time to time he was whimpering :
    “I was bad ,I was mean…”
    I am keeping the contact with my *WIS* ( Well Informed Sources ) to see how this sad story develops…

  152. Scott Lucas says:

    Thanks to all for kind wishes — we are doing well, providing up-to-the-minute coverage from Iran to Syria to Libya to Britain to the US.

    That is, after all, what an effective news and analysis site does.





    P.S. Of course, I have been following the sporadic posts and steady discussion here at RFI. I’ll drop by for a chat if there is anything of value to note.

  153. Sakineh Bagoom says:

    kooshy says:August 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm

    Having learned from Iranians “silent” protests, he has joined the protesters silently; maintaining silence here as well.

  154. fyi says:

    Persian Gulf says: August 8, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    Yes, you are right.

  155. kooshy says:

    Saudi Arabia’s Message to Syria, Decoded

    It is Iranian influence, not the killing of civilians, that Saudi Arabia is concerned about as it recalls its ambassador in Syria

    By Brian Whitaker


  156. Persian Gulf says:


    چیزی که منو به خنده میاندازه امید واهی داشتن به انقلابات عربیه. آخه تو کل دنیای عرب 5 تا متفکر پیدا می شه که ازشون انتظار شق القمر داشت؟ مگه میشه نه علم داشته باشی، نه تکنولوژی، نه تجربه و فرهنگ آزادی و دمکراسی، نه تاریخ، نه … یه دفعه انقلاب کنی گل و بلبل بشه؟ مگه انقلاب ما چی شد؟ با اون وضعی که ما داشتیم 30 سال پیش مگه قرار بود چیز خوبی بشه؟ ما که اول انقلاب نبودیم، ولی 10 سال بعدش رو تا اونجایی که من یادمه ملت اصلا نمی دونستند برای چی انقلاب کردند؟

  157. Persian Gulf says:

    fyi says:
    August 8, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    Historians will write how arrogant Axis Powers were at our time. As we see a country like Belgium, with the history of adventurism not so long ago, in the verge of disintegration, we will soon see more mess among axis powers, i.e. economic hardship for the time being. There is no Soviet Union’s disintegration option this time to have a come back.

  158. Persian Gulf says:

    James Canning says:
    August 8, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Another argument for Libya’s mission, as you are well aware, was to distract the public from the looming nuclear crises in Japan. That project, I think, was to some extent successful.

    Ghaddafi was selling oil and gas to the west with great satisfaction. So, unless Chinese infiltration was really deep, the argument for oil and gas is a bit absurd. Lybi has almost one third the oil that Iraq has. As well, Israel’s involvement here is as unlikely as her involvement with the Iraq war.

    The third argument, more of a conspiracy to me, says it’s somehow a good situation for the west. The country will be more compromising on foreign policies while at the same time there is no need, as yet, for costly process of nation building. This could be true if NATO could control the situation. Now, it’s whole credibility is at stake. the same goes for the U.S alone with senator McCain landing in Benghazi. It was always NATO’s intention to keep the fight far away from its borders as otherwise the divide would inevitably resurface among NATO nations. Now with the mess in Afghanistan, it can’t accept a similar situation in Libya. Btw, what does NATO mean without the U.S? Initially, I hoped for a few weeks resistance on the part of Ghaddafi. He showed that he is really a je**. This situation is spectacular, beyond my belief.

    Obviously Obama is a smart guy. After what the U.S did with Egypt, she could not get involved in Libya boldly. It would have backfired even from the very onset. The only obstacle was their miscalculation of Ghaddafi’s resilience.

  159. kooshy says:

    After the past few days police violence in London, now, the cities of Birmingham and Liverpool are also experiencing public demonstrations and disturbances. London regime’s violation of basic citizen’s rights for peaceful demonstrations has been condemned by Iran, the Islamic republic of Iran, is asking the regime in London to refrain from violating basic human right of citizen’s right to peaceful demonstrations.

  160. Rehmat says:

    The World Jewish Congress reported on Friday that two Israel-Firster congresswomen, Debbie Wasserman Schultz (Jewish) and Ileana Ros-Lehtinen (anti-Iran Christian Zionist) have drafted a new bill which proposes ‘preferred treatment’ to estimated 127,000 Holocaust survivors living in United States currently. In 2007, German daily Spiegel International had reported that there are 250,000 ‘children of Shoah’ alive worldwide, about 120,000 live in Israel – about 80,000 of them live in poverty.


  161. James Canning says:

    Erin Fitzgerald has an interesting piece on HuffingtonPost today (‘Iran’s shadow diplomacy’). She thinks the US should work with Iran in interests of achieving stability in Afghanistan.


  162. James Canning says:

    Writing in the neocon journal, the Weekly Standard, Aug. 15th, Gary Schmitt and Tom Donnelly complained that the gargantuan “defence” budget for the US in coming years will not suffice to deal with ‘threats’ from Iran or China! Complete and utter rubbish, and all-tto-typical. So often, the same people advocate idiotically high levels of ‘defence’ spending by the US, and they also encourage Israel to oppress the Palestinians! Great way to generate an ostensible ‘need’ for insanely high levels of ‘defence’ spending. In other words, working with Israel to scr*w the American taxpayers.

  163. James Canning says:


    Yes, and as Fio pointed out, Kucinich needs to find another seat, in another state.

  164. kooshy says:

    nahid says:

    August 8, 2011 at 4:37 pm

    “Professor Scott Lucas, The last he was being seen in Tjrish (zireh poleh tajrish) with his camera documenting next event”

    Well if the good professor is still there, I recommend that he walks a block up the street to the Ladan bakery and try the famous ice crème to chill out.

  165. kooshy says:


    Considering the scary situation on the ground and the brutality of the regime in the UK, for the safety of reporters, on your future post please restrain from using names or credentials such as “professor”. Just refer to “reliable sources on the ground” that should be sufficient to establish credibility of the report.

    Thank you

    Enduring America & sons
    (Doing our best to endure what is known as “powers” or “International Community”)

  166. nahid says:

    Fiorangela says:
    August 8, 2011 at 4:51 pm

    well , as you know my dear lady, Tehran has shorter winter and he is not relaible to predict, bloody funny. Tajrish is in north of Tehran which he was reportinig by his resources

  167. Fiorangela says:

    Nahid at 4:37 — “Tjrish (zireh poleh tajrish)” — is that Farsi for Punxsutawney?

  168. Fiorangela says:

    James, thank you for correcting the spelling of Dennis Kucinich’s name.

    Nahid, yes, he is and has been the congressman from Cleveland, Ohio, but as a result of the census which showed a decline in the population of Ohio, Kucinich’s district has been eliminated/gerrymandered out of existence. He has been forthright is saying he will NOT run for president, but he WILL try to remain in Congress. Apparently, people in Washington state support him and may give him the opportunity to run.

    It is Cleveland’s loss, and the people of Washington state will be wise to support Kucinich.

  169. nahid says:

    professor Scott Lucas , The last he was being seen in Tjrish (zireh poleh tajrish) with his camera docmenting next event

  170. nahid says:

    James Canning says:
    August 8, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    Dennis Kucinich as far as I know is congeress man form Cleveland Ohio.

  171. kooshy says:

    “London riots: BlackBerry to help police probe Messenger looting ‘role’ The Guardian – ‎1 hour ago‎
    BlackBerry has promised to help police investigate claims its Messenger service helped fuel and organize riots and looting in Tottenham, north London. Photograph: Lewis Whyld/PA The maker of the BlackBerry, Research in Motion, said on Monday night that …”

    So let see if we understand this correctly, the social media and the instant messaging are helping the freedom fighters in Iran and the “Arab springily countries” to organize, but when it comes to the west they are in the service of the looters and police killers, now I got it, therefore not only we don’t need to ask twitter to delay their maintenance, we should actually ask them to start sooner.

  172. Voice of Tehran says:

    kooshy says:
    August 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm
    ” Where is our own professor Scott Lucas of Birmingham ”

    *Well* informed sources in downtown London saw the Professor being whipped in a S&M location.

  173. kooshy says:

    James, where is our own professor Scott Lucas of Birmingham, now that the riots are in his neck of the woods, and when we urgently need his usual reliable on the ground sources, reporting the facts on the ground of the UK’s regime’s brutality in the streets of London, maybe now knowing that the UK security forces are monitoring the internet he is reconsidering posting or twitting.

    Scott- instead of safely copy and pasting reports by the government funded BBC and the Observer on this UK riots, why don’t you post reports by the usual on the ground reliable sources and observers, like what you claim for your reports on Iran and Syria that the establishment news organizations are not reliable the same fact should be considered for your country of residence unless you are scared of possible consequences.

  174. James Canning says:

    Dennis Kucinich (spelling of name of would-be new Congressman from Washington State).

  175. James Canning says:


    By ‘hoax’ do you mean the Tehran reactor has fuel for years to come, without any production of rods by Iran?

  176. James Canning says:


    Dennis Kuncinich has been a vociferous opponent of the western military intervention in Libya, for those not familiar with him. He is losing his Congressional seat in Ohio and has hopes of getting a new one being created near Seattle.

  177. Fahad says:

    James Canning says:
    August 8, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    James, I don’t know. I suppose, it’s a hoax. Iran is not and won’t be able to produce the fuel rods. That would take years. They use the denial of the swap deal (according to the Tehran Declaration) to justify further enrichment. It is true that enrichment to 20% means that there is only a small step to enrich to weapon-grade 95%. This is sort of provocation (and won’t help cancer patients).

  178. fyi says:

    Persian Gulf says: August 8, 2011 at 2:23 pm:

    The Preamble of the American Constitution reads:

    “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves …”

    Note that in the effort to “insure domestic tranquility”, “provide for common defense”, “promote general welfare” the Islamic Republic of Iran is in B+ to A- range.

    In the establishment Justice, in my opinion, it is in C+ to B- range.

    And in securing “the blessings of Liberty…” it is in D+ to C- range.

    The Axis Powers, in their recent vetures in Afghanistan and in Iraq are in the F to D- range across the board.

    And now Libya.

    Really, they should pack and go home since they clearly cannot do any better than the Islamic Republic of Iran.

  179. James Canning says:


    Has Iran actually re-fueled the Tehran reactor with the 20% U it has produced? Did the existing fuel in the plant have a longer time before it needed to be replaced, than had been anticipated?

  180. James Canning says:


    Do you welcome a degradation in the living conditions of the fairly humble people who live in that neighborhood? (Tottenham riots)

  181. kooshy says:

    “Twitter’s Role in London Riots Being Reviewed, U.K. Police Say”


    “Aug. 8 (Bloomberg) — London police will review the role messages sent via Twitter Inc.’s messaging service and other social-networking sites played in two nights of rioting that led to more than 215 arrests and injured at least 35 police officers.”

    Oh James my dear, it seems that the chickens are coming home to roost, bloody lovely ain’t

  182. Fiorangela says:

    Paul Jay interviewed Dennis Kucinish one month ago


  183. Fahad says:

    James Canning says:
    August 8, 2011 at 2:27 pm
    “How could this make any sense?”

    Exactly. Is it mere provocation? Do they want to push the boundaries? They are pretty much on time after having informed IAEA in September 2009 about the site, 18 months or so plus. First, they admitted that Fordow had been sort of plan B in the case Natanz would have been bombarded. When nothing happened at Fordow, Albright speculated that Iranians had lost any interest of Fordow after its disclosure. So, what are they doing there or panning to do?

  184. James Canning says:

    The managing director of Iran’s national oil co. says India paid one billion euros owed for oil; presumably billions more will follow at some time not too far distant.

  185. kooshy says:

    The fact that the KSA is pulling her ambassador out of Syria is actually good news for the resistance, it seems that the Saudi backed efforts didn’t materialized and the western efforts through the SKA founding to divide the security forces didn’t happened. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a payback starting up in Jordan, or somewhere in the southern part of PG neighborhood.

  186. James Canning says:

    Persian Gulf,

    Yes, I think a part of the Franco-British intervention was PR. I opposed it because I felt strongly the chances of it going ‘sideways’ and creating a disaster were all too high.

    Did some neocons conspire, in effect, to have Britain and France take the lead, so Obama could be pressured into backing the effort?

  187. James Canning says:


    The larger question, regarding Iran’s current plan to treble its production of 20% U, is this part of a programme intended to upset Saudi Arabia? How could this make any sense?

  188. Persian Gulf says:

    James Canning:

    I thought, or somebody here said (was it Eric?), the main goal of Libya’s mission was to hijack Arab uprising bc as “fyi” rightly says it was supposed to be quick and easy. it was a mere PR campaign to win the heats and minds of the Arab world with supposedly limited military involvement given the very rapid events of Tunisia and Egypt. whatever the initial purpose, it went wrong badly. I see Libyans in the opposing camp now questioning the rationale of NATO’s bombing. they see the country won’t be back to what it was few months ago for at least 2-3 decades. they would realize it more as time goes by. hopefully for years we will see this struggle going with no avail.

  189. James Canning says:


    Excellent questions. I have raised them in a similar fashion before. Is Iran planning to export the 20% U? Or build a a supply for many years in future, for its own use? Or is there no set plan?

    Sergei Lavrov’s proposal for phased reductions in sanctions is an excelent one.

  190. James Canning says:


    A cousin of my great-grandfather owned a steam yacht and used to cruise the coast of Norway with the German Emperor, in the years before the First World War. You may recall that the Kaiser was cruising these waters during July 1914, unaware that the German General Staff was encouraging Austria to go to war with Serbia. William II thought this was just bluster. He did not become aware of what was afoot, and return to Berlin, until it was too late to stop the war.

  191. Fahad says:

    After Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov’s proposal of a “phased resolution” of the Iranian nuclear issue, David Albright has suggested that Iran should “come clean on nuclear weaponization” before sanctions might be lifted. So, Iran should admit first that it develops a nuclear bomb. Circular reasoning at its best.


    Does anybody here knows why production of 19.75% LEU is going to be tripled at the Fordow plant? While still being incabable of producing fuel rods for the TRR?


  192. James Canning says:


    The British foreign secretary, Sir Edward Grey, expected a very long war indeed. Foolish proponents of a short bit of glorious war, of course did not say (and did not expect) the long, murderous, catastrophic events that followed in the wake of the insane German invasion of Belgium.

  193. James Canning says:


    I meant to say you respond that Israel did not support a given programme, to rebut statements that powerful Jewish interests in America backed that programme. They are not the same thing.

  194. James Canning says:


    If someone makes a point that powerful Jews in the US promoted a certain agenda, to respond that Israel did not support that particular agenda. They are not the same thing. Neocons and Aipac have their own agenda. They wanted the illegal invasion of Iraq even though this was not pushed by the government of Israel.

    Britain, France, Italy, Germany, Switzerland, and other countries, would have been very happy to continue to expand business ties with Libya. They did not plan the revolt. And the military intervention might not have happened if BERNARD-HENRI LEVY, a well-known Jewish intellectual and friend of Nicolas Sarkozy, had not been in Benghazi just when Gaddfi was ranting about exterminating cockroaches. Levy gets a great deal of credit for creating the current civil war in Libya.

  195. fyi says:

    Irshad says: August 8, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Yes, it is part of their Sunni anti-Iran agenda.

    They also will be burnishing their “reform” credentials by supporting the Syiran Uprising against the Alawite Rule.

    But the game in Syria is over; they have suppressed the uprising for now and will be going through mop up operation presently.

    James Canning says: August 8, 2011 at 1:29 pm

    That businessmen were making deals in Libya is accurate but I do not think it will enable you to draw the conclusions that you draw. Singer, the well-know maker of sewing machines, had operations in Germany prior to WWI which they had to forego. Likewise for many other such transnational businesses prior to 1914.

    The business interest were sacrificed in the interest of a war (in 1914) that the European political leaders thought would be short.

    The same political leaders, almost a hundred years later, made the same mistaken calaculations: in Iraq, in Iranian Nulclear case and now in Libya. And rest assured that Jews and Israelis had nothing to do with the events in Libya; indeed Israel does not support actions against Mr. Ghaddafi’s government.

    Axis States must be beaten back to their historical homeland; they can no longer fight, they cannot win, and they cannot put in place durable political and economic orders.

    For the people of the Middle East all they have to offer is more and more misery.

  196. James Canning says:

    Voice of Tehran,

    I too am opposed to the insane effort to kill Gaddafi or members of his family. Vicious, and stupid almost beyond belief.

  197. James Canning says:

    Dan Cooper,

    It appears to be an axiom of contemporary government in the US, that only a second-rate or third-rate strategic thinker, is allowed to be in charge of the Pentagon or the State Department, or the CIA.

  198. Voice of Tehran says:

    James Canning says:
    August 7, 2011 at 6:13 pm
    Voice of Tehran,

    “What do you think should be the way forward in Libya, looking at the situation on the ground today?”

    James , for me at least , it is very difficult to evlaluate the current situation in Libya. But what I know for sure is that the killing of the sons of Gadhafi and his grandchildren will lead to nowhere , it is just insane…

  199. James Canning says:


    Were you following events in Libya prior to this year? Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Switzerland, etc., were all trying to increase their business ties with the Libyan government. They were no trying to undermine it, overthrow it, etc.

    If you are arguing that neocon warmongers, Aipac, other subverters of the national interest of the American people, etc., will try to overthrow any government that is not friendly toward Israel, if a chance presents itself, you have a good argument.

  200. James Canning says:

    Dan Cooper,

    I too was very sorry to see Leon Panetta serving as the whore of the armaments manufacturers, within weeks of taking the job of ostensible boss of the Pentagon.
    Philip Giraldi the other day asked how many carrier groups are actually needed for the defence of the US. Maybe two or three? Four? Surely not ten or eleven.

  201. James Canning says:


    China has chided the US for squandering hugs sums and behaving irresponsibly regarding its budget. All too true. And we can thank the Pentagon for a good deal of this idiocy. Yes, ‘9/11’ was a bonanza for the war profiteers, armaments manufacturers, etc etc.

  202. James Canning says:

    Dan Cooper,

    The piece by Sergei Balmasov, dated Aug. 8th, that you linked, claims that US and/or French troops ‘are deployed in Bahrain, Emirates and Saudi Arabia.’ The French have a small naval force in the UAE. US bases in UAE and Bahrain are well-known. No French or American troops are deployed in any of the three countries.

  203. Irshad says:

    What are people’s views on whats now happening in Syria – the Qataris pulled their ambassador, now the Saudis have done the same, Turkish FM is due in Damascus tomorrow and there is a risk of Turkish intervention with GCC money funding it?

    I find it despicable that the Saudis have decided to enter the foray against the Syrians – is this part of their wider “cold war” against Iran? Or is this a case of the GCC having lost Iraq to Iran, they want to wrestle control of Syria out of Irans orbit?

  204. fyi says:

    Bahram says: August 8, 2011 at 4:13 am

    Nonsense; those young people were not breaking any laws, but no, you & your ilk had to go there and harrass, intimidate, and humiliate them because they engaged in activities that your kind does not approve.

  205. Dan Cooper says:

    USA to destory Iran with smart bombs from Diego Garcia


  206. Bahram says:

    Fyi says,August 7, 2011 at 8:05 pm

    Sure then let all nations do away with man made laws because God has given man the freedom to sin. Please let me know when Denmark abolishes all her state laws

  207. Dan Cooper says:

    Off topic

    No sooner had President Barack Obama signed the bitterly contested federal budget deal than financial markets gave their verdict by nose-diving.

    The best that America’s reviled politicians could say was that the deal was a “down payment” on serious future spending cuts.

    The agreement calls for $2.4 trillion in spending cuts over ten years. A bipartisan committee was tasked with coming up with another $1.5 trillion in cuts by November.

    Considering that the 2011 deficit will be over $1.4 trillion, and the national debt is over $14 trillion, these cuts, if ever realized, are modest, to say the least.

    Obama hailed this compromise as “an important first step.” Many others saw it as the latest example of the growing financial and political paralysis of the United States. The budget deal merely curbs runaway government spending; it does not reduce it.

    As of now, it appears that the heaviest cuts would fall on the social services Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security. In other words, the poor and elderly are to bear the brunt of budget reductions. More guns, less butter.

    Fifty million Americans rely on Medicaid for health care; 44 million Americans rely on government food assistance.

    Not surprisingly, America’s left is fuming with indignation. The right is crowing.

    What is remarkable about this budget is that military spending is largely spared, showing once again the power of America’s military-industrial complex.

    The Pentagon may face cuts of $350-400 billion over a decade.But that’s peanuts compared to the Pentagon’s budget which is now near $900 billion annually when all war costs are accounted for.

    The US military budget doubled after the 9/11 attacks.

    Talk in Washington of a “peace dividend” from ending the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan is illusory. The US-installed Baghdad regime is shortly expected to “request” the US maintain “training” troops in Iraq indefinitely. The same will happen in Afghanistan.

    Meanwhile, the Obama administration has expanded active military operations into Yemen, Libya, Djibouti, Somalia, Kenya, and West Africa. It may end up involved in the new state of South Sudan.

    The US is now “fiscally hollow,” warns respected senior American strategist and diplomat Charles Freeman, noting the entire US military budget is financed by money borrowed from China and Japan. He warns the US is entering a long-term military rivalry with China that Beijing can easily bare but that may prove “fiscally ruinous for us.’

    One cannot avoid the sharp irony that during the Cold War in the 1980’s, the US spent the Soviet Union into the ground. Now, it appears that China may end up doing the same thing to the financially strained United States.

    Few in Washington dare admit that the US can no longer afford “full spectrum global dominance.” The federal budget can only be balanced by cutting in half the gargantuan US military budget which amounts to an amazing 45% or so of world military spending. Add Washington’s rich allies, and the figure rises to 80%.

    Halving the Pentagon budget would only take it back to pre-9/11 days. Wars and vast buildup of internal and external security forces under President George W Bush left a budget deficit of $6.1 trillion, just about equal to the combined deficits of all US presidents since Jimmy Carter to Obama.

    But no one has yet come up with a way to halt this military-industrial juggernaut. While benefits of the poor and elderly are to be cut, the Pentagon is trying to forge ahead with its $1 trillion F-35 fighter purchase. Why not just call up Moscow and Beijing and say, “hey, if you don’t build any new generation stealth fighters, we won’t either.”

    Fat chance. The military-industrial complex and Wall Street supply the lion’s share of political contributions. Jobs in every state depend on continued military production.

    US Defense Secretary Leon Panetta is already warning the nation’s security is in danger if Pentagon budgets are cut. From whom, we must ask. Are Red Chinese troops about to land in Los Angeles? Are the Russians going to grab Hawaii?

    Well, there are always the lurking Muslims whose nefarious plans to impose a caliphate over the USA can only be stopped by new stealth heavy bombers.


  208. Rehmat says:

    fyi – Can you campaign a similar ‘freedom’ for Christian minority in Israel? Those poor Christians have been spit-on and tens thousands of copies of their Holy New Testament has been burned by zealot Jews in Israel for the last 63 years!!

  209. fyi says:

    Bahram says: August 7, 2011 at 6:49 pm

    God has given men the Freedom to be sinful.

    You or Iranian Government cannot – under any pretext – be justified in abjuring and limiting their Freedom; it comes from God.

    I think it best for Iranians to concentrate on educating better quality people; Lion-Hearted Women and Javanmards are what Iran lacks.

    Any way, you need to come to Denmark and experience the freedom there before going back to the Iran.

  210. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 7, 2011 at 6:19 pm

    As I stated before, the Axis Powers will pounce once the opportunity presents itself to deal with what they consider to be odious regimes.

    They can be trusted to be waiting for the opportune time to attack Iran.

    As for Mr. Qaddafi, unfortunately, he has now earned the right to remain Libya’s Leader.

    He has survived.

    For the Iranians, the more Axis Powers get entangled in this “bush fire” wars, the more hay they will make.

    Really, for Axis Powers to have started and continued wars in Afghanistan, in Pakistan, in Iraq, in Yemen, in Libya and no top of it threatening to go to war with Iran; well, frankly, this is insane. But that insanity helps Iran, China, Russia, Cuba, Syria, and a number of other states.

  211. Bahram says:

    No I am not god thanks for asking, and I was not talking about the demonstrations in the Uk. I was talking about Undisiplined spoiled brats with the “freedom to do what ever they want reguardless of the consiquences and how i don’t want Iranian youth to end up like that in the name of social and religius freedom.

  212. James Canning says:


    Didn’t the US insist on immunity from prosecution, for American forces in Britain during the Second World War? I don’t think the idea was to make it easier for a “killing spree’ to take place.

    You probably know that I think all US forces and mercenaries should be pulled out of Iraq by the end of this year.

  213. James Canning says:


    You asked why UK warplanes are attacking Gaddafi’s forces in Libya. My understanding is that some of the leaders in the UK and France want ‘regime change’, and that they do not want a cease-fire unless Gaddafi agrees his family is out of power.

    I think the object should be an effective cease-fire, observed by both sides, without forcing Gaddafi out prior to elections.

    I have thought from the beginning (prior to passage of UNSC resolution), that western military intervention would be a mistake. It may be creating a permanent civil war.

  214. James Canning says:

    Voice of Tehran,

    Yevgeny Primakov, the very sensible former Russian foreign minister, told Speigel last month that he thought there would have been a bloodbath in Benghazi, if Gaddafit’s forces had not been attacked (after the UNSC resolution was passed).

    What do you think should be the way forward in Libya, looking at the situation on the ground today?

  215. fyi says:

    Bahram says: August 7, 2011 at 5:47 pm

    How do you know?

    Are you God?

    And UK has very deep social problems; in projects, in Liverpool, in London.

    The rioters are mostly Black immigrants or their descendants – they are not English.

  216. Bahram says:

    What im saying is tha the freedoms that people are advicating in the Iranian society will eventually lead to the same results as those in western nations such as binge drinking amoungst the youth and a rise in teenage pregnancies amongst other things.

  217. fyi says:

    Bahram says: August 7, 2011 at 4:33 pm

    So you are implying that the Iranian youth – or at least those of a certain social class – are intrinsically immoral hooligans that only the illegal, arbitrary, and forceful action of Police & Moral Police is keeping in check?

    That after 31 years of Islamic Rule (Disaster) in Iran, the youth of that unfortunate country are just one police uniform away from hooliganism?

    I had heard a similar arguments about hejab in Iran; the implication being that Iranian women are harlots with their groins on fire and only staunch male paternalism, exercised through family and social violence is keeping them in check.

    My position is quite clear: playing with water, using water guns, shooting water spouts at one another (boys & girls – really young men and women) are neither against Islam, nor Religion, nor Morality, nor the (Iranian) Law (such as it is).

    It is, however, against the Low Class Iranians’ vision of their Utopian Just Islamic Order. It is against their narrow-minded and bigotted understanding of the how men and women ought to behave.

    Well, I have news for them.

    The World has moved.

  218. Voice of Tehran says:

    Fiorangela says:
    August 7, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    Very interesting post . ( Gilad Atzmon and your comment)
    Each and every time , although I see and read it black on white over and over again , it still goes beyond my understanding.
    How long will this continue and where is the end ??

  219. Fiorangela says:

    uh oh. Gilad Atzmon is gonna be in BIG trouble with the thought police.

    “Israel, that was supposed to be the state of the Jewish people, has become a haven for the richest and most corrupted Jews from around the world: according to The Guardian, “out of the seven oligarchs who controlled 50% of Russia’s economy during the 1990s, six were Jewish.” During the last two decades, many Russian oligarchs have acquired Israeli citizenship. They also secured their dirty money by investing in the Blue & White financial haven. Wiki leaks has revealed lately that “sources in the (Israeli) police estimate that Russian organised crime (Russian Mafia) has laundered as much as US $10 billion through Israeli holdings.” (3) Mega-swindlers such as Bernie Madoff have been channeling their money via Zionists and Israeli institutions for decades. Israel is also a leading trader in blood diamonds. Far from being surprising, Israel is also the fourth biggest weapon dealer on the planet. Clearly, blood diamonds and guns are proving to be a great match. And it doesn’t stop there — every so often, Israel is caught engaging in organ trafficking and organ harvesting.

    Increasingly, Israel seems to be nothing more than a vast money-laundering haven for Jewish oligarchs, swindlers, weapons dealers, organ traffickers, organised crime, and blood-diamond traders. But on top of that, rich Jews buy their holiday homes in Tel Aviv and Jerusalem: there are reports that in Tel Aviv alone, thousands of holiday properties are empty, all year round, while native Israelis cannot find a roof.

    The Israeli people are yet to understand their role within this horror show: the Israeli people are yet to grasp that they are nothing but the foot soldiers in this increasingly horrendous scenario. They do not even gather that their state maintains one of the world’s strongest armies, to defend the assets of just a few of the wealthiest and most immoral Jews around.

    I actually wonder whether Israelis can grasp it all.”

    At least two Jewish-Americans cannot grasp it at all:”

    Jeremy Ben-Ami is mobilizing a campaign to induce US Congressmen to be even more supportive of Israel, as the Hideout for the richest and most corrupted Jews from around the world.

    And Alice Rothchild feels “pain and outrage” that TIAA-CREF, a pension fund for thousands of schoolteachers and academics in the US — a few of whom are not even Jewish — has so far refused to divest its pension funds from companies like Caterpillar, whose products Israel purchases (with American taxpayer dollars) to use to level Palestinian homes.

    Mr. Ben-Ami and Mz. Rothchild are apparently respecting that Torah tale from Genesis (22) that TESTS Abraham’s rhetorical willingness to sacrifice his own kin, but in the end, accepts instead the sacrifice of the property and life of an innocent, unrelated victim that got “caught in the brambles.”

    How ’bout this, Jeremy and Alice: instead of you going to all the trouble of suborning the US Congress, and of getting “pain and outrage” migraines over TIAA-CREF’s commitment to its fiduciary obligations to ALL its pensioners (like me!), rather than engage in political activism for the sake of a few, what if you mobilize Jewish activists to target those “richest and most corrupt Jews from around the world?”

    Be happy to help by supplying some names — Haim Saban springs to mind; and Sheldon Adelson, Aubrey Chernick, Alan Greenspan, Zelman Shapiro, Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith, Stuart Levey, Daniel Cohen and his father — is that enough for a starter?

    Why not attack the problem at its source rather than kill other people’s innocent children for the crime of playing in the brambles where moral monsters pay their homage to a psychopathic god?

  220. Bahram says:

    Fyi Could it be that the reason that we don’t have the kind of juvenile Hoolaginesm in Iran is precisly because of the tight social and religius rules that are strictly enforced in iran by both parents and the broader society.

  221. Arnold Evans says:

    Leaving a comment about Syria from Juan Cole’s site here, in case he decides to block it from his own site:

    AJE also reports on government’s rationale that Hama has been taken over by hooligans and terrorists.

    Well, Hama had been taken over by somebody. You may call them freedom fighters. George Bush the First reminded us that one person’s freedom fighter is another person’s terrorist.

    What they were not was peaceful protesters.

    The security forces loyal to the state had been expelled from the entire city of Hama. Peaceful protesters cannot expel security forces from areas as large as a city.

    If any group expels all forces loyal to the US government from Miami, Barack Obama would certainly call them Hooligans and Terrorists. Those more sympathetic may disagree with that label.

    But the US government under Obama is certainly, with no doubt at all, going to reenter the city with much more powerful weapons, and there is a certainty that if the “freedom fighters” offer any resistance at all, that there will be urban warfare and the fighting will harm civilians, which Barack Obama will have no problem blaming entirely on the “terrorists”.

    Security forces had never been expelled from Cairo, but Hama is nothing like Cairo in terms of the breadth of the national popular support behind the opposition movements.

  222. Fiorangela says:

    “Israel has almost bankrupted America. China owns what’s left.”

    Rather, “Israel has almost bankrupted robbed, exploited, and despoiled America. The loot is stashed in Israel, the gangster hideout. China owns what’s left.”

    Meet Stanley Fischer.


    “Stanley Fischer is an oddity in Israeli government service. A renowned economist who spent most of his life in the U.S., he moved to Israel five years ago, at age 61, to be the Bank of Israel governor—a post roughly equivalent to America’s Federal Reserve chairman. He had to learn Hebrew and take on Israeli citizenship. He has kept the country’s economy stable through two wars and a global financial meltdown. In October, Euromoney magazine declared him Central Bank Governor of the Year. Fischer spoke with NEWSWEEK’s Jerusalem bureau chief, Dan Ephron. Excerpts:

    You have raised Israel’s foreign-currency level substantially, to $70 billion. Some commentators have linked that policy to the prospect of a future war with Iran. Is that the case?

    No, but there are aspects I want to emphasize. There are standards of calculating how much reserves a country needs … We calculated how much we need and then added something to that because this [global economic] crisis had reemphasized the usefulness of having reserves in a crisis. And secondly, because, as we’ve said, we are in a special geopolitical situation “

    – from Jeff Halper, Israeli Committee AGainst House Demolitions :http://icahd.org/(Actually, there is an éminence grise behind Netanyahu for whom these are by no means the first mass protests. Stanley Fischer, the Governor of the Bank of Israel, figures prominently in Naomi Klein’s book The Shock Doctrine.

    From 1990-2005, Fischer,
    —one of Milton Friedman’s “Chicago Boys,” served as the
    —Chief Economist of the World Bank,
    —First Deputy Managing Director of the IMF,
    —a member of the Washington-based financial advisory body, the Group of Thirty and —President of Citigroup International, the world’s largest financial services network which handles, among other things, “global wealth management.”

    According to Klein, it was Fischer
    —at the IMF who urged Yeltzin to “move fast” and sell off as many public companies and resources as possible, leading directly to the economic take-over of the Oligarchs and their allies, the Russian Mafia; “Mafia Capitalism” it was called.

    —He also oversaw the “structural adjustments” of Indonesia, Thailand and South Korea in 1997, where 24 million lost their jobs and the middle classes were devastated.

    In 2005 Fischer was appointed Governor of the Bank of Israel by Ariel Sharon; Netanyahu was appointed the Finance Minister.) “ (see above)

    [Did Stuart Levey and Stan Fischer consult on what actions should be taken under cover of the US Department of Treasury to destroy Iran’s economy?]

    [Anybody speculating that Stanley Fischer consults with Robert Auman at Hebrew University’s Center for the Study of Rationality :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Aumann or should we continue to think that what is happening to the United States economy is just a fluke, a mistake; or in the most memorable words uttered by Alan Greenspan, “It appears the theory was flawed.” :http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/ReserveD ]

    -It was on behalf of Citicorp that the Glass Stegalll act was repealed, leading directly to the financial meltdown of the US economy that the public first became aware of in 2008.

    These facts are coming together in the context of the Tent protests in Israel. Even Israelis are complaining about Israel’s misappropriation of funds:

    “It is not hard to recognize the many billion investments in the settlements all over the territories occupied by Israel since 1967 as assets robbed from the welfare of the next generation of Israelis.”

  223. Voice of Tehran says:

    nahid says:
    August 7, 2011 at 1:28 pm
    “my posts would have dried up by now.”

    “Unknown Unknowns
    Your post never dary up, I am looking evry day to read one line of your post keep posting. You are inspiration for me and God Knows how many others, thanks for all joy your posts give me to read. ”

    I could not have said it better .
    Being left alone with our valuable co-commentators , like fyi , James and others , is a ‘scary’ challenge :-) , no offense :-)
    To be honest , I miss empty very much and our dear RSH ( who is on hunger strike I guess)

  224. Voice of Tehran says:

    James Canning says:
    August 7, 2011 at 1:52 pm
    Unknown Unknown,

    If I may answer instead of our esteemed UU , whom I am quoting later below.

    “You actually think the idea is to have fun killing cililians, in Libya?”

    Yes James , you are close to the bitter truth.
    20 000 attack missions in 4 months by the ‘ brave ‘ NATO pilots , who would conduct the same with much more ‘ fun ‘ , if they were to attack IRI , demonized in 32 years of poisonous propaganda.
    You are totally ignoring the fascist character of the War Beast , which is out of control. Marquis de Sade would be ashamed vis a vis this ‘ animal ‘
    If there is war with Iran , each and every step would follow the pre-scripted Divine wisdom taking into account the ‘wish’ of the purest of purest of souls of the martyrs , who defended their fatherland with bare hands in 8 years of sacred defense.
    Saddam that War Beast , was created by the same , who now out of despair and in absolute insanity think that they can finish the devil’s work by far better than Saddam.
    The martyrdom of Imam Hussein ( PbuH) in the desert of Karbela was NOT in vain.
    This single event , upon Divine wisdom , will reflect in endless endelssness and the message is crystal clear.

    UU in Jan. 2011

    “”In one corner, which Richard has carved out for himself, is the position that war is pretty much inevitable, save some other distraction such as AfPak or the Koreas, or some other known unknown, which will delay the military-industrial Beast’s gorge-fest on Iran, for which he has been salivating for some time now. “Nothing can stop it”, etc. This position is arrived at through reason, given the realities on the ground: economic, political, ideological, technological, etc., all of which make of the Islamic Republic a morsel so tasty as to be irresistible to the Beast, who cares not a wit about the mores of ordinary mortals, not being one himself….

  225. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 7, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    “UK does not want another war in the Middle East.”

    Pray tell me sir then why UK is bombing Libya?

  226. Fara says:

    James Canning says:
    August 7, 2011 at 2:57 pm

    “Muqtada al-Sadr has repeated his prior warning that US troops staying on in Iraq after end of this year will be attacked by his forces.”

    And, Gen. Mullen is asking the Iraqi government to grant legal immunity to the US troops staying in Iraq after 2011. So, I guess the troops will be going on killing spree. Otherwise, why immunity?

  227. James Canning says:

    Muqtada al-Sadr has repeated his prior warning that US troops staying on in Iraq after end of this year will be attacked by his forces.

    One might note here that the neocons have wanted the US to keep permanent military bases in Iraq, to ‘protect’ Israel, since 2003.

  228. Persian Gulf says:

    fyi says:
    August 7, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    Schadenfreude ;)

    the Arab Spring has reached the U.K. yaaaahooooooo

    soon will be in the U.S, I hope.

  229. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknown,

    You actually think the idea is to have fun killing cililians, in Libya?

  230. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknows,

    The Conservatives came into power in Britain in October 1951, and Sir Anthony Eden was foreign secretary. At his first meeting with the American foreign minister, Dean Acheson, his ‘first principle’ (to resolve the dispute with Iran) was: ‘1. There must be fair compensation for loss caused by nationalization of concessionary rights and property, to be agreed upon between the two parties or, in default, settled by arbitration.’

    Britain wanted the International Court of Justice at The Hague to deal with the matter. What entity do you think should have handled the matter?

  231. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Over and out for now.

  232. Unknown Unknowns says:

    James Canning says:
    August 7, 2011 at 1:43 pm
    Unknown Unknowns,
    What is the object of the ‘evil deed’ being perpetrated in Libya by Nato, in your view?


    The gratuitous killing of innocent civilians to satisfy the whim of imperial powers under the preposterous pretext of the prevention of the gratuitous killing of innocent civilians.

  233. Unknown Unknowns says:

    James: you are right: Britain is not a protectorate but a quasi-protectorate, kinda like the house nigger is in a quasi state of slaveery, or kinda like the poodle, which at times thinks it is not a dog, but is, in fact, a dog – and an ugly one at that.

  234. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknows,

    What is the object of the ‘evil deed’ being perpetrated in Libya by Nato, in your view?

  235. Unknown Unknowns says:

    James: I don’t know the facts of the issue of arbitration, but what you say is prima facie false, as there is no reason why Iran would not compensate NIOC through arbitration. In fact that is what Mosaddeq wanted, and offered. But – unless I am quite mistaken – the terms of arbitration were not acceptable, as the venue would not have been on neutral ground. That’s kinda like saying the US would not have invaded Afghanistan if the Taliban had agreed to hand Bin Laden over to the US for him to be tried in a US Federal court, whereas the Taliban had stated that they would hand him over to the International Criminal Court in the Hague – which of course the US declined, as it does not recognize that court’s jurisdiction, being the rogue state that it is.

    Here, this will give you more detail on the unreasonable conditions placed by Britain for the arbitration:


  236. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    What is the basis for your professed belief the UK has been a ‘protectorate’ of the US since 1939?

    Why would Britain have refused to particpate in the idiotic Vietnam War, if the US controlled the UK?

    Alexander Haig, US foreign minister in 1982, opposed any British effort to retake the Falkland Islands by military force (after Argentine invasion). If UK was American ‘protectorate’, how could Britain have waged this military campaign?

  237. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Thank you, Nahid Khanum. As God is my witness, I was not fishing for complements. Now I feel sheepish and regret having said that. I apologize :o) and will strive to continue with my rants, insha’llah.

  238. Unknown Unknowns says:

    James: I disagree. It might have been insular or foolish or whatever of ‘Daffy to say what he said, but once the decision had been made for NATO to do its evil deed, nothing the good colonel could have said or refrained from saying would have prevented history from unfolding as it did. And as far as the confidence you place in international law (a term bordering on the oxymoronic), I don’t share that vision either: What the British FM says or wants is irrelevant, as the UK is a US protectorate and has been since the War of 1939. Likewise, what the US FM and even president want is almost as irrelevant, as that country’s foreign policy has been hijacked by the neocons and General Dynamics and other militant multinational corporations such as Blackwater aka Xe (pronounced zee). All they need do is set up a false flag event such as blaming the Iranian navy, for example, for sinking a battleship which they themselves actually torpedo, and nobody will be able to stop the call for vengeance.

    May the plots and schemes of all liars and cheats and hypocrites, including those hiding in the government of Iran, blow up in their faces. Ameen.

  239. nahid says:

    “my posts would have dried up by now.”

    Unknown Unknowns
    Your post never dary up, I am looking evry day to read one line of your post keep posting. You are inspiration for me and God Knows how many others, thanks for all joy your posts give me to read.

  240. James Canning says:


    Do you actually believe the sanctions imposed against Iran have nothing to do with ‘western’ concern that Iran may develop nuclear weapons? Turkey, China and Russia do not want Iran to develop nukes. And Ahmadinejad says he (and Iran) do not want Iran to develop nukes.

    The sanctions would not exist, but for concerns about Iran’s nuclear programme.

    This is not to say that neocons, Aipac, other Jewish groups, do not exploit fears about Iran’s nuclear programme, to generate hostility toward Iran, to facilitate continuing oppression of the Palestinians by Israel.

  241. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknows,

    Libya is ‘low-hanging fruit’? Do you think Briain and France wanted an extended civil war, to keep oil prices high etc? No country in ‘the west’ even knows what group (or individual) will emerge in control of the coutry. Or even if control of the entire country can be achieved.

  242. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    Any discussion of Mossadeq should bear in mind that Britain would have accepted the outocome of arbitration for value of assets nationalised by Mossadeq. He refused to allow arbitration to go forward. Mossadeq had a great deal of support in the US in 1952.

  243. Unknown Unknowns says:

    paul: the immediate question of relevance for me, given the fact that the Axis of Weasels has chosen to take care of the easy pickins (the low hanging fruit of Libya and Syria) before tackling the thorn in its side (Iran), and given that their efforts in Syria do not seem to be bearing fruit (is that a mixed metaphor? LOL)… the question is going to be how the agent provocateurs of the Weasels will up the ante of brinksmanship in Syria, hoping to draw Iran in, and how Iran will respond.

  244. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    The US/UK attack on Iraq was created by knowing use of false intelligence, in a wide-ranging conspiracy orchestrated by the neocons and Aipac, with vital assistance from major American news organisations.

    An American attack on Iran would be illegal, and the perpetrators of an illegal attack would be far more exposed than were the conspirators who set up the Iraq War.

    Israel is unlikely to attack Iran on its own, with Hezbollah strong in Lebanon. As I have mentioned before, I see a strong Hezbollah as helping to maintain peace in the Middle East.

    Would the western intervention in Libya even have happened, if Bernard-Henri Levy had not been in Benghazi? Gaddafi was foolishly ranting on TV that he was going to “exterminate cockroaches”. Incredible blunder on G’s part.

  245. James Canning says:


    The UK does not want another war in the Middle East. Why would you suggest the UK might like to attack Iran? William Hague makes clear that Britain does not see Iran as an enemy.

    That you would not have opposed Iraqi annexation of Kuwait is very interesting.

  246. Unknown Unknowns says:

    James: “The Libyan war is a bit of a freak. It is not part of a scheme intended to produce a larger war in the Middle East.”


    I wish I had your sense of confidence. But then again its not as if the bombing of Britain is in question. When I get sick of my parents watching BBC Persian and VoA (their programming is truly sickening, whereas Iranian TV – with important exceptions – is merely boring), I ask them what they think their beloved hosts and commentators will say and do when the Anglo-American axis bombs start falling on the heads of your fellow countrymen? And of course they say that will never happen, to which I invariably respond: they did it to Iraq and to Afghanistan, they are doing it to Pakistan and Yemen and Libya, they’re stirring the pot and causing all sorts of chaos in Syria, what makes you think they won’t do it to Iran – the Jewel in the Crown of the ME? That’s where the conversation normally ends. Sometimes, when I am feeling extra indignant, I’ll add that at least the BBC Persian radio staff had the decency to go on strike when the British send an armada to intimidate Mosaddeq, but – I add – these whores and treacherous cretins won’t have those kind of qualms.

  247. James Canning says:

    Dan Cooper,

    I agree with you that the US has squandered trillions of dollars in foolish effort to ‘protect’ Israel – – meaning, to enable Israeli oppression of the Palestinians to continue year in and year out, decade after decade. Most Americans are too ignorant even to be aware this has been happening.

    Do a little research on Abram Shulsky. He teamed with Douglas Feith, Paul Wolfowitz and other American Jews in scheme to set up illegal invasion of Iraq, by deceiving the US public and the US Congress with false intel laundered through the Washington Post, New York Times, etc.

  248. James Canning says:


    China is quite capable of buying its oil from Saudi Arabia and Iran, and other countries. No assistance from the US is required.

    China has its own problem with a Muslim insurgency, in what was known as Sinkiang but some Muslims call East Turkistan. And China worries about Pakistan.

    Russia of course has it own serious problems with Muslim insurgenicies.

    The Libyan war is a bit of a freak. It is not part of a scheme intended to produce a larger war in the Middle East.

  249. Unknown Unknowns says:

    BiBiJon: you are too kind, as usual. But yeah, Frank is one of my heroes too. He saw through all that Christian Fundamentalist bullshit as the Reagan era was giving birth to it, about 20 years before it was even on the radar. I guess his iconoclasm and parts of his persona have infused into my personality and outlook through osmosis, cause I listened to him so much growing up in the 70 and early 80’s. I still have about 50 bootleg LP’s of his, left over from those days. And talking of Wet T-Shirt Night, what a guitar solo! And you are absolutely right: Frank was a straight arrow: he just was a ‘frank’ observer and social critic. He never did drugs, didn’t allow his band members to partake, and even did an anti-drug song (Cocaine Decisions on the “The Man From Utopia” album. Anyway, great to hear we have that in common. And great to hear your continued interest in my posts: if it weren’t for you and Voice of Tehran, my posts would have dried up by now.

  250. fyi says:

    paul says: August 7, 2011 at 11:58 am

    Russia does not support Axis Powers’ policies.

    But she is powerless to do anything directly to oppose them.

    Like Iran, lacking an alliance structure, she has to rely on expediency and subterfuge.

  251. paul says:

    Do you really still think that this has anything to do with nuclear weapons, or that it ever has had to do with that? What we are looking at looks an awful lot like an endgame fast track to a larger MIddle East war leapfrogging from Libya to Syria to Iran to Pakistan. We already can see that Russia will, as always, complain about what the US is doing while covertly supporting it. China is the question. How will China react? They too will likely sit tight if the US promises them oil. So what will most likely ensue is a larger low-intensity war engulfing the entire Eurasia region. But there is a rising risk of a global thermonuclear war.

  252. Dan Cooper says:

    War On Error:

    How Israel Has Almost Bankrupted America.

    By Paul J. Balles

    August 06, 2011 “Information Clearing House” –Error is not a typo.

    Israel’s terror has been America’s error.

    I’ve never been much of a fan of conspiracy theories, though most raise questions that should be answered.

    In 2003, I questioned both the official story of 9/11 and several of the conspiracy theories advanced at the time. My concern then was who benefitted from 9/11?

    My conclusion? Israel.

    In January 2010, I repeated the fact that without 9/11, the U.S. had no excuse for invading Afghanistan. That made G W Bush’s “war on terror” with Afghanistan and Iraq (with Iran in his gun sights) even more irrelevant.

    The battle against Al-Qaeda and bin Laden was the precursor to the invasion of Iraq; and the trumped up connection between Iraq and Al-Qaeda provided one excuse for invading Iraq.

    In an article entitled 9/11 revisited, I summarized 21 questions raised by David Ray Griffin’s book The New Pearl Harbor Revisited. In that work, Griffin pointed out unequivocally that virtually every dimension of the official account of 9/11 was false beyond a reasonable doubt.

    Ever since G W Bush proclaimed America’s War on Terror we’ve had reason to question the veracity of many of the wars that have engaged America.

    The real evidence of who the terrorists are comes from several studies done on the roles played by Israel from its beginning through six decades to 9/11 and beyond.

    A video clip from a British-made documentary from 2002 titled ‘The Age Of Terror’ examines the bombing of the King David Hotel in Jerusalem on 22nd July 1946 by Zionists.

    The south wing of the hotel, then occupied by British civil-military authorities, was bombed killing ninety-one people. Twenty-eight of the victims were British, forty-one Arabic, while seventeen were Jewish.

    The Zionists who carried-out the attack, known as the Irgun, were led by a future prime minister of Israel, Menachem Begin. The King David Hotel bombing was an act of terrorism widely-considered to be the first real incidence of 20th century terrorism.

    Since that time, Zionists with the complicit intelligence gathering and plots of Mossad have engaged in more terrorist acts against Israel’s perceived enemies than those committed by the world’s celebrated terrorists combined.

    In January of this year, Washington, DC-based investigative journalist, author and reputed syndicated columnist Wayne Madsen made a revelation that completely discredited the official story of 9/11.

    Madsen revealed that “British intelligence reported in February 2002 that the Israeli Mossad ran the Arab hijacker cells that were later blamed by the U.S. government’s 9/11 Commission for carrying out the aerial attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon. WMR has received details of the British intelligence report which was suppressed by the government of then-Prime Minister Tony Blair.”

    The entire article should be read by all interested in the unveiling of a true conspiracy beyond theory: http://www.opinion-maker.org/2011/01/british-intelligence-reports/.

    Madsen concludes his exposure with a comment that connects the terrorism of the 9/11 prime minister-to-be to the entire history of Israel.

    “Israeli Finance Minister Binyamin Netanyahu commented on the 9/11 attacks on U.S. television shortly after they occurred. Netanyahu said: ‘It is very good!’

    It now appears that Netanyahu, in his zeal, blew Mossad’s cover as the masterminds of 9/11.”

    It’s now well established that neo-cons in the Bush administration and Israel-firsters including William Kristol, Richard Perle, Ari Fleischer, Paul Wolfowitz, Elliott Abrams, Douglas Feith were responsible for getting America into war with Iraq.

    Now, a decade after invading Afghanistan and continuing the costly game of protection for Israel in the Middle East, America is on the verge of bankruptcy.

    Israel has almost bankrupted America. China owns what’s left.

  253. fyi says:

    Bahram says: August 7, 2011 at 4:27 am

    The dcision in UK was inspired by the fear of hooliganism.

    That there is a weak case in UK is not disputed, given the propensity of their football crowds to engage in street fights.

    That did not obtain in Iran: the numbers in Tehran or in Bandar Abbas were small and the reason cited for arrests were: “un-Islamic” behavior or “non-normative” behavior.

    That is, essentially, behavior that low class Iranians have neither experienced nor endorse; just like women riding bikes.

  254. fyi says:

    nahid says: August 7, 2011 at 7:51 am

    Per their Grand Strategy, they had to prevent independent, potentially powerful states to emerge in criticla (defined by them) areas of the World, specifically in Western Eurasia.

  255. BiBiJon says:


    Just like my hero, UU, I also appreciated your quick demolishing of fyi’s bottomless capacity for disparaging Iranians, their culture, religion, and sensibilities.

    UU, I love your Zappa references. Wet T-shirt Contest Nite track needs to be explained to fyi. My other hero, Frank, was objecting to popular culture denigrating women as objects, he was not celebrating “mammalian protuberances”.

  256. Unknown Unknowns says:


    Thanks for the link. And I know of course that your characterization of the disparity in coverage of the two incidents or phenomena as ‘funny’ is ironic, but I want to give its non-ironic characterization here at RFI, only because sometimes you have to preach to the choir in order to prevent the oncoming of despair:

    The disparity between the two widely differing coverages of the water-gun fights in London and Tehran is a sickening indication of a deep sickness within the West’s psyche, as manifested in its public media – a symptom of the inability to countenance the Other. It is the same sickness that has prevented the leader of “the free world” from literally recognizing Islamic Iran.

    And by the way, besides the public nuisance aspect, the IRI has more reason to regulate this kind of behavior: when clothes of womenfolk get wet, the outlines of their bodies show, not least that of the bosom. This can clearly be seen in one of the pictures towards the end in the link posted. This may or may not be acceptable to the youth participating in the waterplay, but it is not acceptable to their parents, their families, and the society at large.

    Like I had said earlier to Pak and Binam and Bala and Scott and all the other losers who want to see Islamic Iran become so “free” that they can have their sisters participate in Wet T-Shirt Contests if they want to: get over it; it ain’t going to happen.

  257. nahid says:

    FYI please
    why west (USA) wanted to break Yugoslavia ?

  258. Bahram says:

    In regards to the water fight arrests, its funny that when this happened in the UK last year no one made a big deal of it but when it happens in Iran it explodes all over the Internet.With people coming out of the wood works to condem the brutality of the “Evil Mullahs”.


  259. fyi says:

    hans says: August 6, 2011 at 11:09 am

    The lower class Iranians are those who cannot tolerated anything outside of their peasnat culture.

    As an example, see below: these pictures were taken in a park in Tehran 3 days ago.

    Later, many of these young people were arrested for violating “I do not know what”.

    There are no laws in Iran or in Islam against this.

    Yesterday, in Bandar Abbas, another 30 young men & women were arrested for the crime of “Water Play”!

    This is all part and parcel of the gift of the Lower Classes to Iranians of all social classes – Islamic Disaster that is against All Joy.

    Their envy is boundless.


  260. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 6, 2011 at 7:22 pm

    In 1990 the international atmosphere was very different than now.

    There was great hope all over the world for a new era of prosperity, cooperation, and peace.

    The day I heard the news of Iraq’s invasion of Kuwait, I burst out laughing.

    Laughing at how the Arabs had turned on themselves (yet) again.

    Laughing with full metaphysical knowledge that Ba’athist Iraq was going to be destoryed by US.

    And I really do not care who rules Kuwait as long as that ruler is not against Iran – for let us be clear here: Kuwait is nothing but an oil well with a flag.

    Now, we are 21 years passed that time: Yugoslavia happened, the Second Iraq War, constant drum beats of war against Iran, Libya happened, and now Great Recession.

    I believe that Dr. Ahmadinejad was correct when, several times during his first presidency, observed that the “dominant & domineering powers cannot manage the world. But we can help them.”

    He was spurned.

    As for UK and the Nuclear Iran: as a typical American would ask: “Who teh Hell is UK to tell Iran what to do and what not to do?”

    If they do not like what Iran is doing, the leaders of UK can decalre war against Iran and go at it. Who know, they might even win.

  261. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 6, 2011 at 7:17 pm

    The Iranian Nuclear dossiere, just like WMD in Iraq, or Kosovo in Yugoslavia, is an instrumentality to persuade Western publics of the desirability of war with Iran.

    In case of Iran, just like the cases of Iraq and Yugoslavia [and even Panam before them] the issue will be kept alive until the Axis Powers have the opportunity to destroy Islamic Iran.

    The Axis States’ war planners – many in UK, no doubt – might be planning on 2 wars per their pattern in Yugoslavia and in Iraq. The first war to weaken Iran and the second one, after a prolonged period of sanctions, to destroy her.

    Irania leaders are well-advised to plan on such strong possibilities given the precedents of Panama, Yugoslavia, Iraq, and now Libya. My own position in this regard is quite clear, I believe.

    Iran must make the first war very very costly indeed for everyone (for example, Iran must endevor to destriy every single power plant and desalination plant in the Southern Persian Gulf.)

  262. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 6, 2011 at 7:09 pm

    In international relations prosperity is not a primary consideration; power is.

    You are looking at a narrow historical window; one generation since breakup of Yugoslavia. Future will tell if these states will rue the day that they essentially reverted to being principlaities rather than a medium-sized company.

    The break-up of the Yugoslavia – an unofficial member of NATO during the Cold War – was decided in the US Gran Strategy developed by the likes of Dr. Khalilzad at US Ministry of War.

    First salvo was the undermining of her finances which was followed by the arming of Croats.

    That was followed by the usual campaign for ethnic rights etc. that the Axis Powers have perfected as an instrument of aggressive and corecive diplomacy.

    [Another example was the creation of East Timor by the White Trash of Asia (Australia) – taking 750,000 dirt farmers and turning them into a sovereign state like Iran.]

    The next was the ignition of the civil war followed by taking sides against the center of national authority – Serbia.

    Even after Dayton Agreements, the rump Yugoslavia could not be tolerated so Mr. George Herbert Walker Bush, before leaving office, threatened Yugoslavia. There had to always be a cuase belli for US and her Allies.

    This cause – like WMD in Iraq or the Iranian Nuclear File – was kept alive until an opportune time presented itself to finish-off Yugoslavia.

    The rest you know.

    As for Kosovars, they went to that part of Serbia from Albania following the late Benito Mussolini’s Armies. They had no right to that territory; the late Marshall Tito should have expelled them at the end of WWII. But he was not ruthless and cold-hearted as Axis Powers’ leaders.

    When the California Liberation Front starts its campaign of terror, I would like to see if:

    1: Axis Powers will agree to free elections to decide the future of California?
    2: Will they accept a demand by the majority Mexican and Black population to create a new country?

    Likewise for Texas, New Mxico, and Arizona.

    The reason that Iraq is in one piece is because Iran, Turkey and the Shia Scholars in Iraq vehemently oppose it.

    The reason that Turkey and Iran will remian unitary is because their armed forces and intelligence services ruthlessly destroy and stomp on any hint of separatism, so-called ethnic rights etc.

    As it should be.

  263. Rehmat says:

    It seems Tehran is winner in both occupied Iraq and Afghanistan. Iranian companies are active in industrial, mining, infrastructure, irrigation and dam construction projects in Afghanistan. According to IRNA, Iran’s annual export to Afghanistan has jumped from US$300 million to US$1.3 billion within last few years. It’s expected to reach US$2 billion in the current Iranian calendar year.


  264. Reza Esfandiari says:


    How many times has Ray Takeyh published an op-ed in the WP or NYT this year? I am estimating about 10 times. How many have the Leveretts been allowed to present? 0.

    Flynt and Hillary know the editors of Foreign Policy who allows them to publish the occasional article now and again.

    The fact is that the foreign policy realists face censorship by the mainstream media whilst the neocons are allowed to publish any drivel they like. It seems that the editor of WP has agreed that he will accept whatever Takeyh writes.

    It is irnoic that the U.S media are calling for freedom in Iran but are not so interested in countenancing dissenting views from within the American political and academic establishment.

  265. James Canning says:


    A week or so ago, Rogozin said something I very much agree with: “It is absolutely clear that a missile defence aimed against virtual and nonexistent weapons and nonexistent threats can only aggravate the situation.” I continue to stress that the planned ABM system is a device for screwing the ignorant American taxpayers, by the weapons manufacturers (and their legions of lawyers, lobbyists, etc.).

  266. James Canning says:


    Do you think Iraq should have been left undisturbed in Kuwait, after the invasion and occupation of that country in 1990? Would you have supported Iraq’s annexation of Kuwait?

    You seem to argue that the war to force Iraq out of Kuwait was a mistake.

  267. James Canning says:


    The UK does not want a military attack on Iran, by Nato or by any individual country (including Israel). So long as Iran does not decide to build nukes, I do not see this position as changing. Rogozin somethimes gets a bit excited. I do, however, pay close attention to his statements.

  268. James Canning says:


    I think Iraq is very likely to remain intact. Ditto Turkey. And Iran. For that matter, I expect Syria to remain intact also, and I hope to see Syria recover the Golan Heights before too many more years go by.

  269. James Canning says:


    The majority of the people of Northern Ireland wanted to remain part of the UK. Do you think it was improper for the UK government to respond to the wishes of the people of Northern Ireland?

    Do you think Kosovo should have remained part of Serbia?

    The US did not plan for the breadup of Yugoslavia. But, being independent, now Montenegro has excellent prospects for a high level of prosperity. Croatia too. Slovenia already is prosperous on a level close to that of Austria.

  270. Arnold Evans says:

    Ever since Shimon Peres said, to an Arab audience, that the Syrian opposition was fighting for peace with Israel, I’ve felt like the tide has either turned or was turning toward Assad. If the outcome of the conflict was in doubt in the minds of Israel’s intelligence apparatus, Peres would not have risked discrediting the side he would hope would win.

    Hama is now back under the control of the Syrian government, no longer liberated. Syria is calling for general parliamentary elections which will give objective evidence of the popular size and composition of all of the would-be competing factions for power in Syria. These elections have a significant possibility of happening even before the elections in Egypt.

    Now a mainstream Western news source is admitting what was obvious from the beginning, that Syrian claims that the opposition is armed and attacking its security forces are true.


    While it is almost impossible to prove the extent of the death toll, there is growing evidence that violent elements pledging allegiance to the opposition have carried out well armed and carefully co-ordinated attacks against government troops since as long ago as April.

  271. Voice of Tehran says:


    “Hans mach kein Scheiß”
    Sorry if I should have offended you , just felt like writing it…

  272. fyi says:

    Liz says: August 6, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    I acted as a news editor and high-lighted what I beleived to be important.

    And I believe that I indicated his positiv view of the Islamic Republic.

    If you do not find my translation adequate, please furnsih your own.

  273. Rehmat says:

    fyi – When Mossad bugged Nixon’s private conversation with Rev. Billy Graham about Jews being the greatest threat to the US – you know what happened?

    “Rev. Billy Graham warned Nixon of Jewish lobby groups working for Israeli interests instead of the American interests,” the Israeli Wikileaks.


  274. Liz says:

    fyi says:
    August 6, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    “Iranian government has eroded their independence”

    I meant a translation of Ayatollah Sistani’s words! I see you are interpreting it the way you would like it to be. I wonder, if there’s any special reason why you chose to ignore his positive position towards the Islamic Republic of Iran?

  275. Rehmat says:

    One thing which have glued together both the pro-Ahmadinejad and anti-Ahmadinejad groups – is their unanimous support for country’s nuclear program. Surprisingly, the so-called ‘anti-Arab’ too support Iran’s nuc;ear program. A 2010 Arab Public Opinion Poll, revealed that a very strong majority of Arabs support Iran’s nuclear program. In addition, the poll showed that, while 88 percent of Arabs view the Israeli regime as a threat 77 percent view the United States as a threat, only 10 percent view the Islamic Republic of Iran as a threat. (By way of comparison, 10 percent also viewed Algeria as a threat).


  276. fyi says:

    James Canning says: August 6, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    The late Mr. Nixon used all tools at the disposal of his government to destabilize the democratic and nationalist government of the late Dr. Salvador Allende – may his soul rest in Peace and be with the Blessed Souls of Paradise.

    Similar tactics were used in Yugoslavia to destroy it.

    First salvo was the EU states’ withdrawal of financial support for the Federal Government.

    Then came the arming of the various separatists groups residing abroad; the Croatians in Canada of course comes to mind but so does the thugs of the criminal gangs of the so-called Kosovo Liberation Army. All nicely followed by the lies of European Union about thousands of dead Kosovars – just like Libya.

    If the Serbian were not a chaotic and divided people, if they had a staunch leader like Abraham Lincoln or the late Mr. Khomeini, they would have been able to crush these fifth columnist misguided souls and their nefarious machinations that were dreamt up in US DoD and elsewhere.

    But they did not.

    So, now, instead of a strong Federal Republic under which so many different ethno-religious groups could live in relative peace and harmony, you have a number of weak state-lets that could be easily manipulated and squashed by the larger power around them.

    This type of fracturing of political authority is always advocated – under the banner of human rights and assorted lovely words – cooked up no doubt by apprentices to the Lord of Flies – to advance the Axis Powers agenda; world domination if possible, if not – then domination of Western Eurasia.

    So, Iran, Iraq, Turkey, Syria, Pakistan, and eventually India are all candidates for civil war and state break-up.

    Curiously, when it comes to their own polities, the Euro-American states will resort to any dirty trick in the book – short of war – to quash their own separatist movements: Spain with the Basques and the Catalans, Italy and Tyrol, UK and Northern Ireland, Canada and Quebec, US and the Confederate States etc.

    You can protest as much as you like that I am distorting facts etc. That might be. But there is a salient fact which now obtains: nobody trust the proclaimed aims of the Axis Powers; Chinese, Iranians, Russians, Iraqis, Syrians (their governments that is) have learnt the bitter lessons of poor Yugoslavia.

    That it is better to be ruthless and suppress ethno-linguistic disorder than to permit it to runs its course to civil war and state disintegration.

    There is no other way.

  277. JAnas says:

    Russian envoy to nato warns that nato planning an eventual attack on Iran.


  278. fyi says:

    Liz says: August 6, 2011 at 12:51 pm

    Mr. Sistani – an Iranian – states that at the present time, the Shia have many enemies and even though he has some issues withe Islamic Republic of Iran, he has decided to be silent since he fears God and does not wish to weaken the only Islamic country in the World.

    He also stated his concern regarding the independence of the Shia Schools of Islamic Sciences in Iran. [Iranian government has eroded their independence.]

  279. James Canning says:

    Voice of Tehran,

    I would certainly welcome an “awakening” on the part of the people of the EU, to the idiotic oppression of the Palestinians fostered by the US due to overweening influence and power of Aipac and other elements of the ‘support Israel right or wrong’ crowd. In fact, many German, Swiss, Italian etc companies do business with Iran and would very much like to do more.

  280. James Canning says:


    I continue to be curious about why you see a ‘war by the Axis Powers’ against Yugoslavia. Do you mean that you believe Serbia could have forced Croatia to remain in the Federation? And are you unhappy that Serbia is being obliged to accept the loss of Kosovo?

    Do you think Serbia should have used military force, to keep its union with Montenegro?

  281. James Canning says:

    Unknown Unknowns,

    Yes, as Rogozin points out, Russia has seen the UNSC resolution on Libya, which did not provide for ‘regime change’, almost immediately being abused by ‘the west’ to seek just that: regime change. This was a significant error of judgement on the part of ‘the west’, in my view.

  282. James Canning says:


    It might be fair to say that average Iranians are not able to ascertain what adverse effects on the Iranian economy flow from the sanctions, but in any event issues of national pride etc. prompt them to accept the situation. The best figures I have seen indicate the Iranian economy is about 20% smaller than otherwise would obtain, due to the effect of the sanctions. And as others point out, there are countervailing good things that come from the sanctions.

  283. Liz says:

    According to a research conducted by the US National Defense Research Institute (What Do Iranians Think? A Survey of Attitudes on the United States, the Nuclear Program,and the Economy) ,most Iranians who took part in their study opposed the reestablishment of ties with the United States,favored the development of nuclear weapons, viewed the economy of Iran as being “average” or better and did not view sanctions as having a negative effect on the economy.

    quite interesting I must say

    here’s the link for those interested


  284. James Canning says:


    Interesting report, that you linked (that China’s oil imports from Iran, January through June, were about 540,000 barrels per day).

  285. James Canning says:


    The Washington group-think mentality is fostered by the Washington Post, and compliant politicians are in effect protected by exclusion of stories that demonstrate sheer stupidity of those politicians – – in matters pertaining to Israel.
    The core priniple seems to be: keep the American people in the dark, about how much their national interests are being injured, to facilitate continuing Israeli oppression of the Palestinians. This is one of the greatest scams in American history, in effect.

  286. James Canning says:


    The picture is more complex than you indicate. Some opinion pieces that reflect more favorably on Iran do appear from time to time in the Washington Post, The New York Times, etc. The Financial Times prints a fair amount that is accurate and that does not discredit Iran.

    A key factor in all this is the sheer economic power of Jews in America, and their collective ability to reward those who ‘support’ Israel, and punish those who do not.

  287. Arnold Evans says:

    Syria and Egypt are both committed to elections this year:


    I consider this excellent news from the Syrian side. I guess the opposition in Syria may boycott the election, or may try to claim the results were forged despite that Syria, learning from Iran is certain to have a transparent process that (unlike the US’ electoral process) will not leave any reasonable suspicion that result tampering was possible.

    I hope Egypt keeps up, but if not we may by 2012 see perfect symmetry: all of the US’ opponents in the region have gotten the most votes in their elections, all of the US’ allies in the region are dictators who hold power by US-supported force.

    Even that would be a good step forward in terms of clarity and in terms of exposing the cost Israel as a reserved Jewish political majority state for 5.7 million Jews imposes on the hundreds of millions of non-Jews in the region who must live under dictatorships for it to be viable.

    Elections, whether they boycott them or not, unless they win, are the one event the Syrian opposition cannot survive.

  288. Fara says:

    China has increased crude oil imports from the Islamic Republic of Iran by 40 percent in spite of the United States sanctions on Iran’s energy sector.


  289. Unknown Unknowns says:

    NATO is planning military campaign against Syria: Russian envoy
    English.news.cn 2011-08-05 15:58:35

    MOSCOW, Aug. 5 (Xinhua) — Russia’s envoy to NATO, Dmitry Rogozin, said Friday that the alliance is planning a military campaign against Syria to overthrow the regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, local media reported.

    In an interview with Russia’s Izvestia daily newspaper, Rogozin said the North Atlantic Treaty Organization is also probably establishing a long-reaching goal of preparing an attack on Iran.

    Rogozin said a statement Wednesday from the UN Security Council, which confirmed that the current situation in Syria had not yet called for NATO interference, meant that planning for a military campaign was underway.

    “It could be a logical conclusion for those military and propaganda operations, which have been carried out by certain Western countries against North Africa,” Rogozin said.

    Russia has learned lessons from Libya and will continue to oppose “a forcible resolution of the situation in Syria,” Rogozin said.

    He added that the alliance is aiming to interfere only with the regimes “whose views do not coincide with those of the West.”

    The diplomat also warned that the “noose around Iran is tightening,” saying Moscow is seriously concerned about “an escalation of a large-scale war in this huge region.”

  290. hans says:

    including the foolish Shia Utopia Project of the lower classes

    Care to elaborate further, who are exactly the lower classes?

    @Voice of Tehran
    No need to be rude, the communication language here is in English and Farsi unless that is you would like to show off your German skills.

  291. fyi says:

    Pirouz says: August 6, 2011 at 4:44 am

    The fielding of ten of nuclear weapons is a strategic necessity for Iran in order to preserve the cohesion of the state and safeguard its integrity.

    That is the only way that Iran is going to be left alone to deal with her enormous internal problems.

    If Axis Powers and the anti-Iran Arab leaders were smart they would have avoided entangling themselves in Iran back in 1980. At that time, Iranians were oblivious to the security needs of Iran in the international arena and were concentrating on their internal issues (including the foolish Shia Utopia Project of the lower classes).

    Now, of course, it is too late. The experience of Iran-Iraq War, the use of chemical weapons, the Axis Powers War against Yugoslavia, the Axis Powers War against Iraq in 1991 and again in 2003, and now the Axis Powers War Against Libya cannot be ignored by any Iranian leader or set of them.

    What the Axis Powers and anti-Iran Arab states have ushered in is a prickly, suspicious, and competent opponent that will persist in opposing their fantasy projects in the Middle East for the indefinite future.

  292. Unknown Unknowns says:

    It looks as though the confirmation of Qasemi, the former head of the Revolutionay Guards’ construction branch as Energy Minister is another ace that Ahmadinejad El Magnifico just slammed on the table. He is calling for a $40 billion injection of capital into the oil and gas sector for development of upstream infrastructure specifically in fields held jointly, for example, the South Pars field held jointly with Qatar. And whereas his predecessor Mirkazemi has called for a similar figure for this year and the next four years after that, it looks like Qasemi might have the clout to actualize the plan, insha’llah.


  293. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Reza Esfandiari says:
    August 6, 2011 at 6:28 am
    Yes, I have long suspected that the mainstream media is manipulated by the Government and the security agencies. The newspapers and TV stations to give the impression they are “independent” whilst the reality is that they work hand in glove with the Government.

    Reza jaan: my take on this issue is that media (or anything else, for that matter) working “independently” from government is an historical aberration and an atavism of the now-defunct Enlightenment project, with its epicenter in London and Paris circa 1700. The idea then was to deal with the tyranny and absolutism of government by setting up other centers of power: media ‘free’ to publish opinions other than those held by the government, an independent judiciary, a representative legislature answerable to the public rather than to the king, etc. But this was a mistake, because in so far as it succeeds, it fractures and binds the authority, legitimacy and power of a given culture – which of course is why it does not succeed: it only appears to succeed in the naive minds of those people who actually believe, for example, that the United States is a “democracy” (whatever that means) rather than a plutocracy or oligarchy (not to mention kleptocracy). (And in so far as it does *not* succeed, it leaves behind a rotten mess.)

    So again: it was a mistake because it fractured or ‘balkanized’ if you will, the body politic, as a short-term solution to a long-term problem. The Enlightenment impetus, then, was an impulse buy. This is the key to understanding why the two other great and ancient civilizations of the world – Iran and China – demurred and ultimately disdained two-party politics. It is divisive, that’s why. If a body’s arms and legs behave in ways which you don’t like and you cut them off, the last thing you get is five bodies working in harmony with each other. What you actually get is a basket-case: a body going to hell in a hand-basket (to borrow a term from the Vietnam war protestors’ cruel depiction of their returning quadriplegic soldiers.)

    (The five bodies, to complete the metaphor, being the executive, legislative, judiciary, plus the central bank and the media.)

    In conclusion, it should be needless to say, the trick is not to wrest control of the body from the head, to cut the head off, as it were, but to foster a culture and moral paradigm wherein the child is *kept whole* and raised in such a manner as to wield authority and power in his or her adulthood in a way that not only legitimizes but sacralizes the body politic.

    Some of you may recall my earlier statement:

    …the only way to escape from the tyranny of absolutism is for that absolutism to have absolute authority, absolute legitimacy; is for society to be a community. And the only way to approximate that is to have consensus upon the sacred, is to hold values in common that are held sacred: haram, haraam, totem & taboo. Without consensus upon the sacred, one can have authority but one cannot have legitimate authority, and without legitimate authority one either has barbaric anarchy, or the next (but barely) better thing, illegitimate autocracy. *Man’s failure to achieve sacred consensus dooms him to tyranny.*

    Wa’llahu ‘alam.

  294. Unknown Unknowns says:

    Voice of Tehran says:
    August 6, 2011 at 6:12 am

    @ All

    Hey folks , Humpty Dumpty is falling


    That which is falling should also be pushed!

    – Friedrich Nietzsche

  295. Unknown Unknowns says:


    “there isn’t a blessed thing the US can do about it.”

    I thought I had done a good job in translating the Imam’s blessed words, but you have upstaged me. Great job!

  296. Pirouz says:

    hans says:
    August 6, 2011 at 5:03 am

    Not to my knowledge!

  297. Voice of Tehran says:

    hans says:
    August 6, 2011 at 5:03 am
    the region”,

    “I am sure that intelligent person is the owner of “Oskowi on Iran” website!”

    Hans mach kein Scheiss…

  298. Voice of Tehran says:

    Couldn’t resist :

    Supreme Leader: Europe to Experience Islamic Awakening Soon
    Wednesday, 04 May 2011 21:01
    This awakening move will certainly advance to the very heart of the Europe and the European nations will rise against their politicians and rulers…: Iran’s Supreme Leader.


    “This awakening move will certainly advance to the very heart of the Europe and the European nations will rise against their politicians and rulers who have fully surrendered to the US and the Zionists’ cultural and economic policies,” he said.

  299. nahid says:

    hans says:
    August 6, 2011 at 5:03 am

    That is hilarious, real real funny

  300. Reza Esfandiari says:

    Kooshy says:
    August 5, 2011 at 8:09 pm

    Yes, I have long suspected that the mainstream media is manipulated by the Government and the security agencies. The newspapers and TV stations to give the impression they are “independent” whilst the reality is that they work hand in glove with the Government.

  301. Voice of Tehran says:

    @ All

    Hey folks , Humpty Dumpty is falling :

    “Stock market losses limited one – destroyed $ 2.5 trillion turmoil in stock exchanges”


    And S&P downgraded the Creditworthiness of the US from triple A to AA+ , bad for Main Street , but good for Wall Street , makes it easier for the gamblers to sell their junk papers.

  302. hans says:

    The story opens by citing an “intelligence assessment shared with The Associated Press” from “a nation with traditionally reliable intelligence from the region”,

    I am sure that intelligent person is the owner of “Oskowi on Iran” website!

  303. Pirouz says:

    I’ve heard from a few circles the contention that there is a debate in Iran over whether or not to build an atomic bomb. When I inquire as to who exactly is involved in this debate and how they line up. nobody has so much as a clue.

    Juan Cole cites a signals intercept by US intelligence which claims an unnamed IRGC officer was disgruntled over the decision not to weaponize in 2007, but I can find zero evidence in the open-source detailing this claimed “debate.”

    And I have to believe if there was a shred of evidence to support this contention of a debate, the USG and MSM would be screaming it toward us in bold war-font headlines.

  304. Binam says:

    “Ahmadinejad also offers interesting observations about the Arab spring, the Islamic Republic’s 2009 presidential election”

    Yeah interesting observations indeed. For one I wonder what he meant by Mousavi and Karoubi being in the hands of the judiciary. To date no judges have been assigned to their cases and no court dates set. They are being held without any official charges even.

    If the Leveretts don’t get their articles published as much perhaps it is because of their loss of credibility over the years. Still not a single article where they criticize anything the hardliners in Iran do – they might as well be a wing of the Revolutionary Guards.

  305. Ahmadinejad again explicitly states what I’ve argued for some time:

    “One is that those who have bombs are in graver danger than those who don’t…Second, the nuclear bomb is useless and ineffective.”

    Exactly. The Iranians know this. They know an Iranian nuclear weapons program would be useless against Israel, let alone the US and would only place them under threat and further would harm their diplomatic initiatives in the region. This is why they don’t have a nuclear weapons program. The only time they ever considered otherwise is when they thought Iraq might be trying to get them. This is why I KNOW Iran does not have a nuclear weapons program. They’re not stupid enough to have one.

  306. Fiorangela says:


    U.S. triple-A debt rating cut by Standard & Poor’s
    10:15p ET August 5, 2011 (MarketWatch)

    WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — The United States late Friday lost its triple-A debt rating from Standard & Poor’s for the first time in its history, with the credit-rating agency saying the political system of the world’s top economy has become less stable and that budget cutting announced earlier this week didn’t go far enough.

    S&P lowered its rating on the U.S. by a notch to AA+ and, to compound the embarrassment, said the outlook is negative as well, as it threatened another reduction in two years. The rating agency said the deal reached by lawmakers to cut the federal deficit by an estimated $2.1 trillion over a decade didn’t go far enough, and “America’s governance and policymaking [is] becoming less stable, less effective, and less predictable than what we previously believed.” Read text of downgrade.

    S&P, a unit of McGraw-Hill , had said in July that $4 trillion in cuts over a decade would be required if the U.S. were to keep its triple-A rating. The U.S. has over $14 trillion in debt, and, even after the deal reached this week, is anticipated to add another $7 trillion over the next decade.Read more on debt-ceiling deal.

    By S&P’s analysis, the U.S. debt-to-GDP ratio will hit 85% by 2021.

  307. fyi says:


    This is business as usual; the Axis Powers have to keep the Iran issue alive until there is an opportune time for them to pounce; just like Iraq and Yugoslavia (where the Kosovo was first made an issue and then was kept alive).

    For Iranians, part of the response will have to be an concerted effort to weaken and or to destroy the structure of Axis Powers in the Neaer East.

    THus they will keep the issue of Al Quds alive, the treatment of Shia in Bahrain and Sauid Arabi, keep low level contacts with Taliban, etc.

    This is a zero-sum game.

  308. Rehmat says:

    James Canning – FYI, British prime minister David Cameron told House of Common on August 5, 2010 that Tehran already had nuclear bomb.


  309. Rehmat says:

    When Obama moved into the White House, like his speech at Cairo – he also lied about having meaningful dialogue with the Islamic Republic. Someone, who has studied Obama’s political career, patronized by Zionist Jews, I never took Obama’s rants seriously. And, I was not wrong. Since day one, Obama has carried a policy of threats, sanctions, intimidaton at isolating Iran from world community, subverting its economy, threatening its civilian nuclear program and bringing a pro-Israel regime-change in Tehran. However, the Iranian leaders with their faith in Islam and national patriotism – has succeeded in blocking US-Israeli evil design…….

    Obama totally defeated by Israel Lobby

  310. BiBiJon says:

    This is the part of the AP agitprop that was most amusing:


    A U.S. official cited one assessment he has seen suggesting Ahmadinejad may be more “moderate” — more open to talks with the international community on resolving nuclear concerns than Khamenei. He asked for anonymity because his information was privileged.

    But a blunt comment by Ahmadinejad last month raises questions. While repeating that Iran does not want nuclear arms, he openly reinforced its ability to make them, telling Iranian state TV that “if we want to make a bomb, we are not afraid of anybody.”

    That defiant statement fits the scenario laid down by the intelligence assessment shared with the AP, depicting Ahmadinejad as wanting to move publicly to develop a nuclear program.

    End Quote

    Ahmadinejad has said exact same thing several times in previous years. And, of course he means by it that he simply is not afraid, period. He is not afraid to tell the truth. And, if the truth were that Iran was making the bomb, he would come right and say so. As the Imam said, and Ahmadinejad often quotes Imam’s sayings, ‘there isn’t a blessed thing the US can do about it.”

    The Orwellian scene we all live in, turns everything upside down.

  311. kooshy says:

    Reza Esfandiari says:
    August 5, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    Reza, may be you are not familiar with our lineup here in the US, to have access to WP you have to be vetted by the pentagon and the security establishment, NYT and CNN are more accessible to State Department approved pundits. No chance in the hell one would be allowed to say something positive about Iran anywhere in the major media.

  312. Reza Esfandiari says:

    I am at a complete loss. Ray Takeyh seems to have unlimited access to the Washington Post and the NY Times. He can write any garbage and they will publish without so much as reading it. The same goes for Karim Sadjadpour. But the Leveretts – who actually have some practical insight -have to struggle to get a piece published: and only because of their editorial contacts (like with Foreign Policy).

    Can we have some debate and freedom of speech in the mainstream press on the matter of Iran or is only one totalitarian viewpoint permitted in the “free media”?

  313. James Canning says:

    Regarding Ray Tekeyh’s op-ed piece in the Washington Post the other day, I continue to wonder if he is trying to conceal the stupidity of the crowd in Washington who insisted that more sanctions would bring about negotiations and an end to Iran production of LEU etc. And I wonder whether some of those who pushed so hard for more sanctions, only pretended to believe the sanctions would “work” as supposedly intended. I rather think Takeyh is please to provide cover for foolish American politicians.

  314. James Canning says:

    Bravo! Yes, how interesting that even after Ahmadinejad said very clearly indeed, that Iran does not want nukes, numerous stories were carried in American newspapers and magazines claiming Iran is building or about to build nukes.